♥self reflecti°n bread♥ [Archive] - Page 2 - ZEFRANK.COM

trisherina

07-08-2007, 01:16 AM

I was at a huge indoor waterpark with our daughter (10 next month) when in the late afternoon she ran into a school friend and asked if she could go down some slides with him. Sure, I said, recognizing the boy who stood beside her, You know where to find me. "My dad's right over there," said the boy, gesturing to a huge crowd of people to my right. And I settled into my poolside lounge chair and snoozed in the sunshine.

After about a half hour, I snapped to. Where was she? I resolved to watch the wave pool. Since she'd never spent twenty minutes at that park before without finding her way back to the wave pool for some bodysurfing, they were bound to show up soon. But they didn't.

I started to sweat and my stomach churned. I thought of little Madeleine McCann and how I'd read the stories and had uncharitable thoughts about parents who went out to dinner elsewhere while their preschool children slept alone in hotel rooms. What had I been thinking? I didn't even know the last name of the boy our daughter had gone off with. I scanned the crowd to my right -- did any of the men look like the boy? Most of them did. An hour had passed, and no sign of them. I sat up straight and ogled the wave pool like a pedophile on Dexedrine, my heart pounding.

Perhaps I was being taught a lesson about uncharitable thoughts. Perhaps I should have tried harder to worship a deity who could help me out in times like this. Perhaps I should have been a little more on the ball and told her to watch the clock and report back to me in such and such a time. Perhaps I could rely on the inevitable drive for an afternoon snack to bring her back to me. Perhaps she was with people I didn't know going places I'd never see, and here I was waiting while they traveled far far away! Could I have her paged? Could I call the school and ask for the boy's last name and phone number? I called my spouse on my cell phone -- he wasn't answering. The hour and a half mark passed. I calculated and recalculated the time, remembering when we'd had lunch and the last time I'd seen her. I mentally catalogued any identifying marks I could remember, and tried to recall a good recent photo.

I vowed to trade my life for hers, right now, no problem, if she would just appear. Appear! So I could tell her just how foolish it was to leave me sitting here for an hour and a half! I knew her father would forgive me if the inconceivable happened, but I would never forgive myself. And I wouldn't forgive him if the tables were turned. Another child wouldn't fix it, either. Seventeen years, down the drain all because I had been so careless.

At one hour forty-five minutes, I saw a familiar head shape way on the other side of the wave pool, and yes, there was a fat little blonde boy right next to the head shape! I wiped my eyes, pretending it was the sun so the German ladies next to me wouldn't get curious, and went back to being a normal person again.

brightpearl

07-09-2007, 09:42 PM

I've been thinking about snuffing it. Not planning it of course :D ; I mean, just thinking about that subject. I read an essay (Douglas Rushkoff) on zombie movies today, and I like this quote:

Deep down, these schlocky horror flicks are asking some of the most profound questions: What is life? Why does it depend on killing and consuming other life? Does this cruel reality of survival have any intrinsic meaning?

So, my love of B movies means I'm really cerebral and profound. :p

Is a zombie alive? Whether the answer is yes or no, what is the difference between it and me?

auntie aubrey

07-09-2007, 09:50 PM

i'm going to assume that means you frequently partake of live brains.

brightpearl

07-09-2007, 10:05 PM

^:D But that's kind of my point. I mean, I might as well. I've been vegetarian for a long time, but I literally owe my body and my son's body to a long personal and family/evolutionary history of meat-eating. Somebody back there ate live brains on a regular basis, I'm sure. And even now, the harvesting, de-pesting, and preparation of my food causes the deaths of unimaginable numbers of organisms. I can hardly be smug about my current diet in that way. What does this say about me, if anything?

But then there's free will, right? Only maybe there isn't (http://sci-con.org/2002/05/the-illusion-of-conscious-will-by-dm-wegner/).

Even laying aside the question of whether or not I'm capable of anything more than the illusion of volition, I'm not sure that either "alive" or "dead" really describes me fully. If you're a historian reading this on some kind of historical archive thousands of years from now, I'm certainly not alive. And though I apparently remember being alive yesterday, I'm not sure I have any real empirical proof of that. I could check by waiting to see if I'm alive tomorrow, but if I'm not, what will that tell me?

Thank you for indulging this bizarre train of thought, whether it was volitional on your part or not. In conclusion,
http://www.cartoonstock.com/lowres/hsc3138l.jpg

lukkucairi

07-10-2007, 12:48 AM

whether or not it's actually provable that I have free will, I have decided that it's in my own best interests to believe that I do :)

trisherina

07-10-2007, 01:15 AM

It certainly makes the traffic tickets much easier to swallow.

Jack Flanders

07-10-2007, 01:35 AM

I've always been the one to remove my sister's, room-mates' and kids' spiders from harm's way and in a humane way. After this last weekend while gardening and receiving my fourth spider bite in one year, and watching my hand balloon -up, again, I say, "Never again!" Die, Spidy, die!!! Except I love the ones who weave their beautiful webs near my back door light.

brightpearl

07-12-2007, 05:44 PM

Okay, I thought I was a zombie, but it turns out I'm just the drummer from Spinal Tap.
<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/fKxbpo433Kk"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/fKxbpo433Kk" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>

auntie aubrey

07-12-2007, 06:51 PM

^ my full name is auntie "stumpy" aubrey.

brightpearl

07-16-2007, 12:52 AM

Tunesmith

07-16-2007, 01:40 AM

Okay, I got it. The difference between me and a zombie is...

I brush my teeth.:D

OH, and also, a zombie can't see its own similarity to, its connection with, another zombie, much less a human or a cat or a blade of grass.

But what about the hive mind? Doesn't a zombie have some form of primal brain that allows it to differentiate between living dead and non-living dead, aka the living?

About the "free will" debate, I recently read an article that had a very distinct view of human nature (I'll see if I can dredge it up):

The author, a neuroscientist, believed that free will was an illusion; what existed instead, was free won't - the ability to make a split-second decision to not complete an action. The author argued that most of our behaviors were determined by our animalistic side, or the one that seeks, primarily, food and sex. Therefore, the main function of the levels of consciousness from which a sense of morality arises is to safeguard our behaviors, to prevent us from giving in to our hedonistic sides.

It's depressing to think that we're just mindless drones, like our friends the undead zombies, and an existential brainbuster, too. :(

I guess it's just another abstract idea.

Frieda

07-16-2007, 06:21 AM

But what about the hive mind? Doesn't a zombie have some form of primal brain that allows it to differentiate between living dead and non-living dead, aka the living?

About the "free will" debate, I recently read an article that had a very distinct view of human nature (I'll see if I can dredge it up):

The author, a neuroscientist, believed that free will was an illusion; what existed instead, was free won't - the ability to make a split-second decision to not complete an action. The author argued that most of our behaviors were determined by our animalistic side, or the one that seeks, primarily, food and sex. Therefore, the main function of the levels of consciousness from which a sense of morality arises is to safeguard our behaviors, to prevent us from giving in to our hedonistic sides.

It's depressing to think that we're just mindless drones, like our friends the undead zombies, and an existential brainbuster, too. :(

I guess it's just another abstract idea.

i believe in this theory, that we cannot change a damn thing about ourselves. we're all subjective to the same set of rules that the universe falls under, nothing less and certainly nothing more as some people seem to think.

taking this one step further: i also believe that it is futile for the preservation of mankind on planet earth to heal our sick and to start saving the environment. all the signs say that there's too many humans.. so nature makes us destroy ourselves.

but that's another theory ;)

craig johnston

07-16-2007, 07:09 AM

It certainly makes the traffic tickets much easier to swallow.

you eat them?

:eek:

Hyakujo's Fox

07-16-2007, 08:01 AM

It's depressing to think that we're just mindless drones

so don't think it. anyway, i'm sure you have a mind, drone or not.

Someone once told me (or someone else by the same name at least) "The enlightened man is one with the law of causation." I can't really say any more or I'll get in trouble.

brightpearl

07-16-2007, 08:58 AM

But what about the hive mind? Doesn't a zombie have some form of primal brain that allows it to differentiate between living dead and non-living dead, aka the living?

Yes, but I think that is like telling your dinner from the plate. It doesn't necessarily involve empathy. At least, that's what I'm going with at the moment. :)

The free will thing bothers me, too, but I will say that after giving it quite a lot of thought over the last few years, I'm disappointed to report that I clearly do not act with as much free will/forethought as one might have hoped. The good news, I think, is that now that I've spent time trying to pay close attention to the process, there is sometimes a teeny tiny space between stimulus and response, and sometimes a little thinking goes on in that space.

Or so I imagine.

brightpearl

08-10-2007, 09:50 PM

Q: What happens when an irresistable force meets an unmovable object?

A: 10

ha ha ha ha

brightpearl

08-13-2007, 01:06 PM

I found a frog by my shoes this morning. I have no idea how he got in. He was half the size of my hand, and the door closes tightly, and no one had been in or out for hours.

I needed to get out the door, and I was feeling upset, and I couldn't find my shoes. I finally remembered I had left them inside the back door when I had come in the evening before. I reached down to pick them up, and he caught my eye when he moved to put his little hands over his head to protect himself. I've never seen one do that before. It was so pitiful -- if the cat had found him instead of me, his tiny hands would've done him no good -- but it was also so wise an instinct. Without his tiny froggie hope of protection, I might not have seen him. I picked him up, and he had a string and a lot of cobwebs around his back feet. He must have been under the couch at some point. It took me a long time to get him untangled, and then I took him outside. I put him at the edge of the water, and he hopped in a far as he could, and dove deep.

I tend to think that hope isn't any better than despair, overall, but maybe a little hope in the face of the unknown is better than nothing, when you're a frog.

I just want to be the person who carries the frog back out to the pond. It doesn't matter whether it results in a live frog or a fed heron. It's the only way I can hope to remember to go to the pond myself.

I can't figure out why I'm so much better at learning this lesson from animals than people.

auntie aubrey

08-13-2007, 01:40 PM

perhaps you called the frog to you.

Frog's song calls down the cleansing power of the rain. Frog is a reminder of the sacred power of tears to tranform and cleanse away sorrow. Frogs will die if away from moisture for too long, and thus Frog reminds us to refresh ourselves, and allow joy to moisten our lives and our hearts. If you are feeling "muddied" by the world, take a moment to dream, to laugh and cry and renew yourself.

craig johnston

08-13-2007, 03:38 PM

expectation = disappointment.
so why bother to expect?

:confused:

:(

T.I.P.

08-13-2007, 04:13 PM

brightpearl

08-13-2007, 04:27 PM

perhaps you called the frog to you.

I <3 you, auntie. Long live frogs and sitting in pudding.

expectation = disappointment.
so why bother to expect?

I think there is a slight but significant difference between hope and expectation. But your point has a lot to do with what I've been thinking about.

.

That is as good a thing to say as any. :)

auntie aubrey

08-13-2007, 04:56 PM

i just typed and deleted a self reflecti°n that was far too revealing.

my new self reflecti°n is that i have a lot of self reflection to do before i'm ready to participate any more the self reflecti°n bread.

Stephi_B

08-14-2007, 04:39 PM

^^^^ Is it possible to not expect anything (i.e. usually the best, although they proverb 'expect the worst...' advices that rarely somebody really does, or?) at all? Or at least hopes (^^ yes, a difference, less conditional) for the best?
Can it be that there is a similar mechanism behind expectations - a mechanism we hardly can influence - like with us altering the perception of past reality (selective memory) and un-/semi-consciously alter how we see reality just now (pink glasses, self-betrayal, etc.)?

Have to do some self-reflexion (first on my own, off-board, just like Auntie) why my latest - passive - encounter with the expectation=disappointment phenomenon still effects me so (too?) much. Yes, and if 'not A = B' holds true, 'no B = A' does too. This last equation bugs me a lot...

brightpearl

08-14-2007, 04:43 PM

I think that expectation results in disappointment so often because when we focus on what we expect, we miss what actually comes. It's possible for hope to be more open, but it is still problematic, I think. My point is just that despair is as ill-advised as hope, and it's less pleasant in the interim.

Stephi_B

08-14-2007, 04:52 PM

^Very good points indeed!
The ideal case would be to just step out in the void and see what happens. But very few people are able to do so.

Hope is defininitely a better choice, but the line to expectations, i.e. 'I want this and that to be so and so', is close.

brightpearl

08-14-2007, 05:14 PM

The ideal case would be to just step out in the void and see what happens. But very few people are able to do so.

Yes, I think it takes a lot of practice at paying close attention to one's self/mind/motivation/intention etc. But I know people who seem to be so. They still experience pain and loss, but they seem to be less distressed by it overall.

Stephi_B

08-14-2007, 05:26 PM

Remarkable!

I try to practice that path from now on! :)

Stephi_B

08-15-2007, 11:59 AM

Self-reflection breakthrough!
Was already on the right track, but got distracted by that stupid A--B thing after re-reading this old email: It isn't about being rejected as a woman, getting a scratch in my 'female honour' etc pp (that bugged me mayhap a week, though something like that rarely happens to me, my problems with men are not about 'getting' them - 'nother story...), but about feeling rejected as a person. Also think I know why such a sort of rejection - whether real or only perceived by me (?) - can hurt me so deeply. But this ain't the place to elaborate on that, too private and painful piece of my past.
What's the solution: Anger? Might help temporarily. But that's bullshit: He's a lovely person, touched my heart, just can't be angry, he reacted like he did, I reacted like I did - e finito! Guess, it is about time to face the root of that weak point of mine. So everything had sense nevertheless - bringing me to see that.

auntie aubrey

08-25-2007, 04:59 PM

i decided to stop being a shit.

there was this girl, you see, and she was my best friend throughout high school and into college. but one year we decided to live together and roommate tension ruined the friendship. and i'll admit i was kind of a shit about it. we were both shits, but i'm not going to lie and say it was more her than me. we stopped talking, or rather i stopped talking to her.

it's been 10 years. a mutual friend has popped back into my life twice in the last decade to casually mention that my ex-best-friend is doing well. both times i've hemmed and hawed and decided not to reach out and say "hi, sorry about all that crap we did to each other."

a couple of days ago i decided to stop being a shit and i sent her a hello and offered a genuine expression of happiness that she's doing well. i decided i didn't care whether she got back to me or not, whether she was over it, whether she was willing to just move on. it was like humbly reaching out sincerely wishing her well allowed me to forgive myself for being a silly little girl all those years ago.

today she emailed me back and said she was happy i'd decided to break the silence. and now we seem to be talking again.

i feel like a part of me has been healed.

i'm not the same person i was 10 years ago. 10 years ago i was unsure of myself and knew nothing about life outside of my parents' protective cover. i was the picture of arrogant, insecure youth and, let's face it, my friend was too. i have no illusions about rekindling the friendship; i would imagine she's not the same person she was 10 years ago, either. but who knows. maybe we've both evolved in a compatible way and maybe we can get to know each other all over again. there's a glimmer of possibility that a new friendship can rise from the ashes of the old one. whether that glimmer actually develops further remains to be seen.

but the important thing is, i did it. i decided to stop being a shit. and it feels pretty damn good.

brightpearl

08-25-2007, 05:22 PM

^Auntie, you make me proud to be a person.

brightpearl

08-25-2007, 09:15 PM

You know Auntie, I was thinking about this some more. When I was in elementary school, my best friend turned on me, like girls do sometimes, you know? Her dad was a bully, and if the psychologists are right, it had something to do with that. So, she bullied me, and she got every other girl in the whole class to go along. It was really, really bad, and it went on for two years. I tried everything to get her to like me again, but nothing worked, and eventually, I just gave up. That's when it stopped, of course, and for some reason, I wasn't mad at her. The next year, in middle school, we said hi in the halls sometimes. Then, one day, we were standing around for some reason, and she blurted out that she was sorry for everything she'd done. I could tell that she had been wanting to say it for a long time, and I told her I knew, and that it was okay. I meant it. We never became close after that, but we always remained on speaking terms.

I understood then how much it took for her to apologize, and how much it took for me to forgive, though both seemingly came easily in the moment. There's a lot of room for that sort of thing, when you're open to it, though things may never return to what they were before. Whatever happens is okay. It's the re-meeting that's important.

So that's why I think it's so cool that you did it, and that you posted about it. Good on ya.

Making soap is a good occupation for you. ;)

trisherina

08-25-2007, 09:28 PM

Being a shit is kind of like smoking. It takes twice as much work to quit once you've started, because it takes way more work to eradicate the shit impression than it does to just start out making a non-shit impression on people. The best thing of course is never to start with shit, but that's hard to do when that red fog comes over you and ... you know. The red fog.

auntie aubrey

08-25-2007, 10:41 PM

oh, i'm familiar with the red fog.

Earthling

08-25-2007, 11:06 PM

I love red frogs
http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u212/TEDDY_000_photos/redfrog.jpg:p ;)

brightpearl

09-01-2007, 08:32 PM

auntie aubrey

09-01-2007, 11:00 PM

What's the only thing in existence that you can't see?

the back of your head. the space between your shoulderblades. the space behind your pinnae.

i have been told that i have a freckle behind my left ear. i will never see it without the aid of a mirror and never knew to look until i was told.

And though your cochlea is constantly emitting a faint hum, your ear can't hear it barring an injury.

Heller and Bergman (1953) conducted a study of 80 tinnitus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinnitus)-free university students placed in a soundproofed room found that 93% reported hearing a buzzing, pulsing or whistling sound.

brightpearl

09-02-2007, 12:04 PM

That's true...maybe it is more like, you can't perceive your head with your head.

hmmm.

And though it might take some practice, I think this girl might be able to see her shoulderblades. She scares me, and yet I find her familiar.
http://www.kqed.org/topics/local/gallery/images/androgyny345x439.jpg

auntie aubrey

09-02-2007, 12:44 PM

i'm glad she's wearing tights.

T.I.P.

09-02-2007, 01:19 PM

M'kay.
So. What's the only thing in existence that you can't see? Your eyes. I know, I know, you can see them in the mirror, but that's the reflection of your eyes rather than your eyes themselves. And you can't smell your nose, right? Your fingertip can't feel itself. And though your cochlea is constantly emitting a faint hum, your ear can't hear it barring an injury.

Thus, I'm beginning to wonder whether understanding consciousness by means of conscious thought is a fruitless endeavor.

It's interesting to note that technically your body is "aware of itself" through what is called proprioception (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proprioception).

Proprioception is "the sense that indicates whether the body is moving with required effort, as well as where the various parts of the body are located in relation to each other. (...) It is essentially a feedback mechanism: that is the body moves (or is moved) and then the information about this is returned to the brain whereby subsequent adjustments could be made(...)the proprioceptive sense is believed to be composed of information from sensory neurons located in the inner ear (motion and orientation) and in the stretch receptors located in the muscles and the joint-supporting ligaments (stance). "

My understanding is that the proprioceptive process is for the most part unconscious, in that your body does not require a conscious effort to know where all of its limbs are at a given moment. If it did require conscious effort, it would become extremely difficult to go down a set of stairs really fast, for instance.

So basically conscious thought only represents a ridiculous fraction of the actual processing going on in our mind at a given moment. I think this tends to support your final statement, actually...

brightpearl

09-02-2007, 02:25 PM

^Yeah, proprioception is interesting. The proprioceptive neural pathways are separate from exteroreceptive ones (sight, pressure, temperature, etc.); proprioceptors are housed in the skeletal muscles and the ear and use stretch, etc. to approximate the placement of the body in space, but exteroreceptors are in many kinds of tissues and require an external stimulus in order to receive data. That's what I meant about the fingertip not being able to feel itself -- your finger's proprioceptors send your brain information about where it is in space, but your fingertip's exterosensory neurons can't perceive pressure or temperature unless something acts upon them.

So if your experience of the information sent by your exteroreceptors are part of who you are, your self must include the things that act upon you. Interesting. :)

Also, proprioception is easily fooled -- just spin yourself around a few times, or turn your computer mouse upside down and try to point and click...takes some adjustment! Also phantom limb feelings, lots of other examples. So proprioception is not direct perception of "reality", whatever that is...

Oh, I've tied my own brain in a knot!

S'okay...I can't perceive it directly, so I am unperturbed, whoever I am.

tapanuli

09-02-2007, 05:49 PM

Attempting to learn how people "learn" math and how changes in the adolescent brain affect that process, I basically belly-flopped into neurodevelopmental psychology and this is the result-- this diagram is a synthesis of my understanding-- however incomplete and perhaps scientifically invalid. None the less, it was inspired a diagram in Schumann's The Neurobiology of Learning, perspectives from Second Language Acquisition.

1479

P.S.- That three page paper was never written, but I did learn about the basal ganglia and the role it plays in my own ADHD. Go fig. :rolleyes:

Frieda

09-02-2007, 05:55 PM

^^ and ^^^ i have distorted proprioception of my right lower leg, due to CRPS. it basically means that if i don't look at my leg, it's not there in my body image, and it feels like it was never there at all. it feels really weird.. if i stick my leg in water or something i can feel the water, but it is extremely disturbing because i'm feeling "someone else's leg" get wet.

and it's really dangerous on staircases, yes. and i keep banging it into everything if i don't pay attention!

edited to add: and if anyone can provide a solution for this problem please let me know!

tapanuli

09-02-2007, 06:18 PM

edited to add: and if anyone can provide a solution for this problem please let me know!

Frieda--

DISCLAIMER: I am not a doctor, nor do I claim to have any professional credentials, certifications, education or training. This message is for conversational purposes only.

Because your "problem" is localized to one region, my instinct says that some type of lesion or process interrupting phenomena is occurring in your brain. Has this been like that your whole life? Have you ever experienced any brain trauma or been in an accident? What type(s) neuroimagng has your doctor(s) ordered? [Just asking... no answer expected.]

Maybe people with more "global" pain issues like fibromyalgia (cough, mother) have problems on a more cellular level across the body.

http://web.lemoyne.edu/~hevern/psy340/graphics/homunculus.jpg

With sympathy,
Tapanuli

Frieda

09-02-2007, 06:32 PM

well, it's because of the CRPS that i have this weird thing going on.

CRPS causes all kinds of tissue damage.. bones, muscles, tendons, nerves, arteries.. anything! the damage is almost always local, in hand and feet. then it moves on up, if you're unlucky. doctors dont know why some people get it and others don't.. stress (elevated adrenalin level) is a well-known facilitator..

so it might be happening in the brain.. but the majority of the symptoms happen in the affected area of the body.

http://www.rsds.org/2/what_is_rsd_crps/index.html

brightpearl

09-02-2007, 06:48 PM

^I remember you mentioning once that you broke your foot -- is that when it started? Do you have referred pain or altered sensation elsewhere?

I'm certainly not an expert, but until I went back to school, part of my job was helping people deal with pain. There are ways to lessen it sometimes, but a lot of it is more learning strategies to cope with what you have. CRPS is a real peripheral neurological phenomenon, not a symptom of a psychological disorder, although there are types of brain injuries that can cause similar disassociation with some part of one's body. You are lucky to be properly diagnosed, and I hope it didn't take long to get that.

Well, relaxation practice, various forms of meditation, and breathing exercises have been shown in clinical trials to help reduce several kinds of pain, and so have accupuncture/accupressure and some kinds of hypnosis. I would think that accupressure might be contraindicated in CRPS -- even light pressure is often a problem, isn't it?

Have you tried WEED?
I'm not really kidding. :D

brightpearl

09-02-2007, 07:00 PM

You know, a discussion of the body and pain is a good fit for the self-reflection thread. Part of our experience of pain is housed in the ego. Although the pain itself is enough, we so often add to it by building a story around it...why do I have this pain, who caused it, who is helping me or not, what it means for the past or future.

And the body...is it the person? I have a friend who is fond of saying that the body doesn't lie, but that the mind may misinterpret its message. In the case of CRPS though, perhaps the body is lying, in a sense. But I don't think so. I think it is sending a message in the best way it is able, and the brain interprets it as faithfully as it can, but there is a mis-match. What does this mean for the self -- Does your self really stop where your leg begins? But the sensations it sends you are part of your experience. Is it something like being pregnant? You feel something moving, but it isn't you? Mothers can cope with that oddity by bonding with the baby emotionally. Have you thought of making friends with the leg, learning to love it again? I hope that doesn't sound flippant...I'm quite serious. :o

Frieda

09-02-2007, 07:07 PM

WEED certainly helps, but not in a healthy way.. so i had to quit :eek: sudden changes in blood flow and blood pressure don't do much good with CRPS.

the foot incident was indeed what started it all-- took 4 months to get diagnosed, they told me i was too late with all the symptoms that i had, i was supposed to never walk again. i am able to walk now, i sometimes use a crutch.

i can handle the pain, but the altered proprioception makes life very dangerous.. it takes a while to realise that it's your foot burning on the radiator.. or as i mentioned before, to walk down stairs without thinking, suddenly there's a leg in the way.

it's tricky because it feels like my leg has never been there before.. so i don't pay attention to it. i continuously have to remind myself that i actually have a lower right extremity!

acupuncture and acupressure is good, but not on the limb, it works great in the spinal cord area/neck.

the pain is bad, but not the worst. the worst is accepting limitations. especially when they told me that i might never walk again, never again takes a really long time when you're young!

and what you say in your 2nd post is indeed the key-- many people with CRPS hate their disabling limbs-- i was taught to love it, instructed to paint my nails a different color every day, and stimulate it. and it worked! :)

Stephi_B

09-03-2007, 06:18 AM

Frieda - wish you good luck and progress!!

Dunno much about what you have, but I'll ask my dad (a doc @ job office, he sees people with a broad variant of symtoms, maybe he has experience with something similiar) next time I phone with him, if he has additionally info I post/PM it.

Hope this isn't a too trivial suggestion:
Have you tried to wear a
http://www.silbergaleria.de/Ohrringe_/Fusskettchen/DSCN0016.jpg
? Or would it feel too strange/cause you pain?
Maybe with some jingling elements it could remind you more often of having a leg... (oh and anklets look good in any case ;))

:)

brightpearl

09-03-2007, 08:23 PM

^That's an interesting thought, Stephi. It might add to the info coming from auditory exterosensors in order to help coordinate with malfunctioning proprioceptors. More info from more sources is usually better, assuming it's sent and interpreted correctly...maybe something like the way that you can adjust when you turn your mouse upside down by using visual information.

Frieda, I'm glad you had some improvement over your initial symptoms. I'm not surprised that trying to re-bond with the limb can help CRPS...makes sense with what I know of how our relationships with pain/the body/other people work. It reminds me of when my son was a newborn and had no control over his limbs, no understanding that they were his. He used to accidentally scratch his face and get mad. (At who? :D) So it's a process you've had to do before, when you were much younger. I would imagine it's something of a work in progress.

Accepting limitations is really difficult for me, and yet my whole life has been one long lesson in doing just that. (I'm not anywhere near done, unftly.:o ) Most of us have an instinctual rejection of the idea that our self can be limited, and when you consider that it's natural to think of your body as your self, things like aging and injury are hard to swallow. I think that paying close attention to our ideas about the nature of self, who we think we are, can be helpful in accepting such processes as okay, and also in eventually understanding the actual nature of what it is to be. If my body is me, why am I still me when I trim my nails? What about if I lost a finger? An arm? Where is the line between me and not me?

I recently heard someone say, "I am different now than I was when I was a child. Which one is the real me?" It's so easy to think of some former or idealized manifestation of ourselves as the "real" one...to think that we were "really" ourselves when we were the most popular kid in school, or before we sustained some illness, or we would really be ourselves if we were only an astronaut or married to that perfect person, etc. But how can this be so? How can the real you possibly be separate from exactly the way you are right now? It's really hard to find true boundaries, when you look closely, and yet our rough estimations of them can be useful in a relative way. It's good to know how you feel and what you want and to try to get them, especially if you can also learn to be content without those things if they can't be had.

Tunesmith

09-03-2007, 09:53 PM

I've been reading this thread for the past few minutes with a constant "whoa..." on my lips.

Frieda, I'm really sorry to hear about your leg - I hope that someday you regain total ability.

I don't know if this will be helpful, but I remember reading about a woman who lost her entire sense of proprioception, leaving her "without a body". I don't know the details of the study, but eventually she regained some awareness through physical therapy (i.e. resetting her sense of position) and compensated for rest by focusing on each part of her body whenever she needed to use it - walking took months to relearn, but wasn't impossible.

I know this is a single case, and therefore might not apply to yours, but after her recovery, the woman said that she liked to go driving in convertibles with the hood down, because the sensation of the wind wind reminded her that she had a physical body. Maybe Stephi's ankle-bracelet suggestion would be helpful, not only because of the sound, but because of the physical stimulus.

best of luck, Frieda!

brightpearl

09-03-2007, 09:57 PM

^There are lots of such case studies in Oliver Sacks' many books...they're really useful for self-reflection, if you remember that every person in them is fundamentally the same as you are, and he's a wonderfully compelling writer.

Tunesmith

09-03-2007, 10:43 PM

^ Hmm, I've never thought of them that way...they've always just seemed like scientific studies.

*digs through bookshelf for worn-out copy of The man who mistook his wife for a hat*

Tunesmith

09-03-2007, 11:03 PM

Lately, it seems like things just flow onward.

I often find myself looking back on a day, wondering where the hours have gone. It could just be a product of the summer winding down, but it's not the sort of wistful, school-dreading, Calvin-esque (as in Calvin & Hobbes) reminiscing for the "good ol' days of catchin' bugs and readin' comics and just talkin' with my pet tiger" that I find myself doing.

For example, I sometimes find myself ending conversations with little or no memory of the past 10 or so minutes, but an absolute sense of nowness, of being in the present moment. And when traveling across the country last month, the fact that I was on the opposite coast didn't hit me until after a week or so.

It makes me worry sometimes that I don't know how to snap out of this frame of reference, or if I even should. With college on the horizon, the school year starting, and major life decisions impending, I'm not sure if I'm going to be adequately prepared for the problems that may and will arise.

Ah well, gotta trust the old subconscious to take care of those thing. :rolleyes:

trisherina

09-04-2007, 12:55 AM

http://www.phatpimpclothing.com/hi/phatpimp/images/expimpshoesblack.gif

you will be aware of your feet at all times!

brightpearl

09-04-2007, 01:15 PM

Trisherina makes a very good point.

Lately, it seems like things just flow onward.

I often find myself looking back on a day, wondering where the hours have gone. It could just be a product of the summer winding down, but it's not the sort of wistful, school-dreading, Calvin-esque (as in Calvin & Hobbes) reminiscing for the "good ol' days of catchin' bugs and readin' comics and just talkin' with my pet tiger" that I find myself doing.

For example, I sometimes find myself ending conversations with little or no memory of the past 10 or so minutes, but an absolute sense of nowness, of being in the present moment. And when traveling across the country last month, the fact that I was on the opposite coast didn't hit me until after a week or so.

I think you have the half of it, tunes, but that's only the half of it. It won't do alone, as you're discovering. Now see if you can catch a glimpse of the other half without losing sight of the one you've got....:)

zero

09-04-2007, 01:58 PM

tunes dinnie listen to beryl - tell her to
SUHT UP

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1015/1161079468_e104361264.jpg

brightpearl

09-04-2007, 02:02 PM

Ezra's right; I've only got the half of it...

Tunesmith

09-04-2007, 02:13 PM

tunes dinnie listen to beryl - tell her to
SUHT UP

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1015/1161079468_e104361264.jpg

it's comforting to know that the SUHT UP man, unruly eyebrows and all, has got my back. :D

auntie aubrey

09-11-2007, 10:07 AM

late last night i opened the front door to find what i initially thought was a small pile of doggie doo just on the other side. one double-take later i realized it wasn't doggie doo. the toad was back.

this is the second time i've found a toad out here, and for some reason both times he chose our door. this time he was actually pressed up against the door itself, hunkered down. he didn't seem to mind as i stepped over him and inspected him closely.

it wasn't a particularly artful position so i knew i wouldn't get a particularly artful shot. but here he is:

http://www.gofalldown.com/cacophony/myimages/toad.jpg

as i knelt down i tried to go easy on my bad knee since it's still healing. i put all of my weight on my right side and coddled the left. but i just wasn't getting close enough for my satisfaction so i scooted forward. and put my weight down on my bad knee.

it felt like two pieces of sticky mylar peeled apart somewhere deep inside the joint. it wasn't painful, but it certainly didn't feel "right." i yelped in surprise. the toad didn't move. my husband showed up to ask me what on earth i was doing.

peeling sensation or not i decided i was already down here, so i should keep going until i got the shot i wanted. i did this, knowing i would never get a shot i felt was actually "good." and i did this, knowing i already had a set of shots of the doorstep toad from a few weeks ago.

i've learned something about myself. there's something inside of me that needs to document things. it's like that obsessive hoarder syndrome but instead of hoarding objects, i hoard vision. no amount of pain or potential self damage is apparently too much to overcome the need to capture the moment. and no amount of rationalization about the end quality of the shot can sway me from my goal of putting a moment into a single frame.

this morning i have a slightly sticky feeling in my knee. but at least i got my shot, such that it is.

T.I.P.

09-11-2007, 10:18 AM

i've learned something about myself. there's something inside of me that needs to document things. it's like that obsessive hoarder syndrome but instead of hoarding objects, i hoard vision. no amount of pain or potential self damage is apparently too much to overcome the need to capture the moment. and no amount of rationalization about the end quality of the shot can sway me from my goal of putting a moment into a single frame.

this morning i have a slightly sticky feeling in my knee. but at least i got my shot, such that it is.

yay to self-endangerment for the sole sake of obsessively hoarding photographic instants ! :)

I had a similar self-reflection in March when I found myself in a vacant lot on Far Rockaway chucking all of my airplane luggage over a rusty 7 foot fence just because I had decided that I needed to take pictures of the Beirut-like scenes of emptiness that you can find along the beachfront during that period of the year.

That toad shot is awesome by the way. It doesn't look intimidated whatsoever by your presence.

auntie aubrey

09-11-2007, 11:00 AM

^ i have a feeling that in a way, many of us here are vision hoarders. how many of the picture themed threads continue to exist simply because we want to share something we saw?

and i'm glad i have your validation because i just knelt again. this time it was a praying mantis. i'm still processing my shots but here's a taste (http://www.gofalldown.com/cacophony/myimages/mantisdetail.jpg).

i love bugs. and unfortunately my knee injury is trying to interfere with that love. because the best bugs bugs don't generally pose at eye-level.

T.I.P.

09-11-2007, 11:04 AM

wow :eek:

topcat

09-11-2007, 12:03 PM

did you kiss the frog? might be a prince.

auntie aubrey

09-11-2007, 12:50 PM

i already found my prince AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWfart.

tapanuli

09-12-2007, 03:10 AM

And one day, your pictures will be discovered all over again.

Brynn

09-15-2007, 12:25 AM

auntie, those are amazing pictures!

Tunesmith

09-25-2007, 12:00 AM

:mad: :mad: :mad:

I just spent the last 1/2 hour writing a really concise explanation of my opinions about the internet and I accidentally DELETED it!!

grrr...

lukkucairi

09-25-2007, 01:11 AM

Tunes, those are the best kind - the ones that get deleted. They're too good to let out into the wild, so God takes them home before they can be sullied by foreign eyeballs :)

Hyakujo's Fox

09-25-2007, 01:44 AM

:mad: :mad: :mad:

I just spent the last 1/2 hour writing a really concise explanation of my opinions about the internet and I accidentally DELETED it!!

grrr...

I think you've summed it up pretty nicely.

brightpearl

09-25-2007, 07:46 PM

This morning I was driving in the dark. Just as the sun was coming up, I crested a hill and drove straight into an oddly isolated fog bank, and for a minute I couldn't see a thing. Each microdroplet of water was reflecting a tiny, perfect image of the headlights back at me, so that nothing but bright white fog was visible. Having the lights on, trying to see, directly resulted in the inability to see, so I turned them off and made my way around the bend with just the light of the early sun.

Then I was through the fog, just like that, and it seemed best to turn the lights back on.

What this means, I've no idea.
:)

brightpearl

11-10-2007, 01:14 AM

Earlier today, I heard someone say that life lived the usual way is like chewing old gum.

He didn't mean it in a bad way.

Still, the implication was that it might be good to stop chewing and consider spitting it out.
http://www.artistsai.org/Studio_Programs/Long-term_Studios/images/lee_chang-jin.jpg

zero

01-21-2008, 05:29 PM

^http://bulletin.zefrank.com/images/icons/icon14.gifhttp://bulletin.zefrank.com/images/icons/icon14.gifhttp://bulletin.zefrank.com/images/icons/icon14.gifhttp://bulletin.zefrank.com/images/icons/icon14.gifhttp://bulletin.zefrank.com/images/icons/icon14.gif
ME TOO!!:D

Frieda

01-31-2008, 08:51 PM

i finally realize how much i miss going out dancing somewhere in a club or just at someone else's place with a nice cd on-- it's the thing i miss most ever since i got handicapped.

took me 3 years to realize. sheesh!

brightpearl

01-31-2008, 09:04 PM

^c'mon frieda, cut a rug with me!!
<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/myJj0mNNe1Y&rel=1"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/myJj0mNNe1Y&rel=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

Stephi_B

01-31-2008, 09:20 PM

Yes and when Perla needs a little power-nap on the rug (this killer moves of her take their price) you dance on with me :)

Frieda

02-01-2008, 01:08 PM

yeah well that's exactly what i mean-- i post dumb video clips of music i used to dance to. then i turn the volume up and fwking PRETEND i'm dancing in my living room.

it's not exactly comforting. more like very very sad.

Stephi_B

02-01-2008, 03:18 PM

Frieda! :( Girl, I'd steal you a supergood leg and the docs to make it work on you - if that were possible.......

If it's "only" the problem of tracking your leg (particularly in clubs, at parties -> dark, distractive), I thought about
http://www.gotparty.com/flashing_shoe_lace_5.jpg
or something similar.

Am a bit worried about you :(, also that you got too much things bumping around in your head to let you sleep (without / with too few sleep over a time things start looking darker than they are, that again makes you sleep bad etc.)

Frieda

02-01-2008, 07:17 PM

nah it's ok-- it's the way things are-- it just pissed me off that it took me so long to realize it's not walking i miss, but dancing. i miss the fun i used to have.

--> i should get out more. i have at least 3 appointments at different doctors every week that i have to rush to after work so i really need to do something fun in my life. and by that i don't mean the shit i "enjoy" now such as internet shopping or neurotically surfing through several websites to see if there's anything new.

i shouldn't pretend to be dancing, i should just go out and fwking dance. there! :)

Stephi_B

02-01-2008, 07:26 PM

^Yay!! That sounds a lot better and gives me a happy! :) :) :)

Stephi_B

02-01-2008, 07:34 PM

^Yay!! That sounds a lot better and gives me a happy :) :) :)

Frieda

02-01-2008, 07:42 PM

i do dig those shoelaces. i would wear them to work in my yellow sneakers on one of those weird casual fridays when we have to celebrate some sort of company win :D

brightpearl

02-02-2008, 12:44 AM

i shouldn't pretend to be dancing, i should just go out and fwking dance. there! :)

yes yes yes!!
That was my intention in posting the clip.

brightpearl

05-19-2008, 09:28 PM

I was walking across an empty-ish parking lot earlier with my son trailing behind, talking about dinosaurs. It was sunny and hot, and we were going to get groceries.

All of a sudden I realized that I was walking in a tableau that's been played so many times as to be near beginningless and near endless...mom leading, kid following, out to get food, some random but educational chat...and I felt a little pull on that thread that runs through me, and him, and you.

Oh! I'm a part of things.

zero

05-20-2008, 05:54 PM

:mad: i've left myself at least six voicemessages today and am getting very annoyed that i haven't got back to myself yet.

Frieda

05-26-2008, 07:25 PM

i'm fed up with work-- i'm bored beyond belief, unable to come up with new projects and unable to finish the one i'm currently running due to boredom beyond belief.

i wish i was an astronaut instead.

xfox

05-26-2008, 08:31 PM

sounds like you're due for a promotion. If you manage that well, it's time you start leading, directing others?? yes? You could teach me a few things, I bet.

Frieda

05-27-2008, 05:09 AM

a promotion, oh i wish.. :) thank you :)

unfortunately i'm only working 50% now because of my foot issue.. so i'm really not in a position to make any demands :(

Hyakujo's Fox

05-27-2008, 05:32 AM

nah, you get a promotion, next thing you know they are paying you more, and it's even harder to leave.

evil I tell ya, evil.

Hyakujo's Fox

05-27-2008, 05:34 AM

WHERE'S MY REFLECTION DAMMIT, WHAT AM I? A VAMPIRE?

Hyakujo's Fox

05-27-2008, 05:34 AM

thank you :)

brightpearl

08-11-2008, 07:11 PM

The other day I crossed my legs and noticed a quarter-sized spot on the bottom of my foot that looked like it had been gouged by a cheese grater. I couldn't figure out how I could have had that much damage done to my foot without realizing it, or why it didn't hurt right then. Later in the day, it did start to hurt, every time I took a step. I figured I was just my mind being aware of it then, or that it had swollen just enough to cause pain, and that it would heal up soon enough...just have to bear it until then.

And then I took a step just right, and the acacia thorn that had been lodged in my shoe, gradually digging into my foot, plunged through the sole and into my skin. It took that much to get my attention, and make me think about what I could do to shield myself from getting hurt more. When I pulled the thing out of my shoe, I was shocked that I had tolerated it without noticing, and then without thinking.

It's more or less healed up now.

Frieda

09-03-2008, 06:48 PM

wowieee, this day sucked monkey balls :(

Frieda

09-06-2008, 06:38 AM

so tired from these fwking hedgehog dreams

i'm starting to believe they're true.

β cyg

09-10-2008, 03:17 PM

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3012/2769919207_2602b3b264.jpg

lukkucairi

09-11-2008, 01:27 AM

2008:<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/lukkucairi/2846940013/" title="us at burn 2 by lukku cairi, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3038/2846940013_0fee2803f3.jpg" width="500" height="333" alt="us at burn 2" /></a>
2008:<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/lukkucairi/2847773002/" title="us at burn by lukku cairi, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3094/2847773002_82156d04c4.jpg" width="500" height="333" alt="us at burn" /></a>

lukkucairi

09-11-2008, 01:34 AM

2004:<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/lukkucairi/41228/" title="aren't we cute? by lukku cairi, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm1.static.flickr.com/1/41228_af6a739d49.jpg" width="419" height="274" alt="aren't we cute?" /></a>

my husband says he was looking at some photos of me from when we got married in 2004, and he says that I've changed so much that he barely recognizes me then as the same person as me now.

Frieda

09-11-2008, 03:30 AM

there's something in your eyes, you know.

Anna

09-16-2008, 04:06 AM

Frieda

09-19-2008, 08:31 PM

i finally figured out why i'm a freak magnet.

brightpearl

09-19-2008, 08:35 PM

Really? I hope it's helpful to understand.

How are your kidneys?

brightpearl

09-19-2008, 08:36 PM

By the way, if you can figure out why *I'm* a freak magnet, I'd love to hear it.

Frieda

09-19-2008, 08:41 PM

^^ it's worse than i thought actually. not the kidneys, there was nothing to be seen.

^ idunno. i just decided to stop giving people a 2nd, 3rd, 4th or 5th chance and see how that works out. i bet it's interesting.

brightpearl

09-19-2008, 08:47 PM

Not kidneys? Hmmm. They did an MRI or something else?

Frieda

09-19-2008, 08:47 PM

echo ultrasound unit thing whatever its called in english, blood test, pee test, pap smear

nothing nada niks

brightpearl

09-19-2008, 09:04 PM

M'kay, I'll break out the candles and white voodoo dolls.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3113/2628881716_023d7817e9.jpg

lukkucairi

11-07-2008, 12:03 PM

I had a panic attack for the first time in a while last night. It's amazing how even after all these years - I've had panic disorder for half my life - I can still be blindsided by an attack. The feelings are so "legitimate" that it takes a while for me to figure out they're coming from a bunch of rogue chemicals in my bloodstream and my brain, and not from my own volition.

It confirms for me that there really isn't such a thing as "volition" - at least not in the way we're led to believe. If my adrenal glands go into overdrive and hork a massive wad of hormone into my blood - and especially if there is no objective target for the fight-or-flight reaction - I will still make up a reason WHY I feel this way.

Looking at the "reason" from a viewpoint outside of my feelings, I can always see the lack of proportion, or even the complete lack of causal connection. But from inside the panic, it becomes the entire universe to me.

I did fairly well last night, all things considered. In the past I've left a trail of destruction behind me when in panic mode, but here in the middle of my third decade I seem to have developed a subroutine that kicks in and removes me from the situation, and that further removes me from any handy communication devices.

Now if I can love myself to not judge myself as a failure this morning, we'll be back on our way.

Frieda

11-07-2008, 01:53 PM

^hugs for you :)

trisherina

11-07-2008, 03:09 PM

I will still make up a reason WHY I feel this way.

Good brain, still working, just misbehaving. :)

MoJoRiSin

11-07-2008, 03:21 PM

^ two things to try:
benadryl allergy medication:: takes about 20 minutes to work
(only do this if you wake up in the night and need to be somewhere the nest day and look presentable < however set your alarm 15 minutes earlier for the alternating hot/cold shower you will need to get over the +grogginess:confused:

2. meditation
(with a candle in a room decorated and kept tidy out of
love and respect)

(this idea has no adverse side effects)

lukkucairi

11-08-2008, 02:55 AM

24+ hours and the panic finally drains away...wow!

thanks for the hugs :)

I texted a friend who suffers the same malady at 2am in desperation - and he recommended I pinch the sides of my tongue together with my fingers. Amazingly, it worked pretty well. That, and warm goat milk.

So, do I exist at all? If my consciousness is just a colored reflection off the riffles of the water surface? Does it even matter? Ah...

Brynn

11-18-2008, 08:10 PM

This is what my ego looks and sounds like when it takes over my body and fills my head with roof-brain chatter:

<object width="450" height="370"><param name="movie" value="http://www.liveleak.com/e/8d4_1226471679"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.liveleak.com/e/8d4_1226471679" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="450" height="370"></embed></object>

Now that I've identified it for what it truly is - a yapping entity completely separate from who I am at my essential core - but masquerading as my "needs" "desires" "fears" "personality" or the part of me that "gets offended" and wants to "get even," I'm going to have to starve it to make it go away. It's pretty dysfunctional and defective, and needs to be put out of its misery.

Frieda

11-18-2008, 08:52 PM

^dude you scare me. not the ego stuff but the other thing about starving your yapping inner doggie :( what yapping doggies really need is a cuddly hug, you know? it's more effective.. really :)

Brynn

11-18-2008, 09:34 PM

oh I've been nurturing that metaphorical thing and catering to it for years. I've become my own enabler! :eek: See, I think it's drowning out the real me, and that's the one that needs the hug.

As for the actual doggie in the video, I do feel very sorry for the poor little thing and would very much like to hug it and give it biscuits. I don't think it would help him very much, but it might make him feel better.

lukkucairi

11-19-2008, 01:36 PM

Am I the jackass?

I realize now that it was my own annoyance with this "being judged for acting out" that drove me to mention it in the first place. The email could have been far more to the point. "They broke up. Let's support" would have sufficed. I have acted out in the past, and I have been judged for it. I'm not proud, but I think I've always been, basically, a good person. Anxiety drives you to do socially awkward things. Handle the anxiety, the social issues tend to evaporate.

Was I acting out by mentioning the social results of this acting out to a third party? Or have I simply had a trust betrayed? Or both?

I don't know what to do here. Talk, I guess, and not get angry or personally threatened by the situation.

In other words, don't act out.

:o

lukkucairi

11-20-2008, 01:21 AM

^ OK, there's not much to that I care to explicate...

but I have noticed that this particular bit of drama made me feel far less like shit than previous similar dramas.

can it be that I'm learning?

Jack Flanders

11-21-2008, 04:00 AM

I unintentionally really pissed you off again, B. I am sorry. I'm a DUMB ASS.

madasacutsnake

11-23-2008, 07:04 AM

You could take a pot plant to work.

Frieda

11-23-2008, 09:34 PM

I LIKE BIG BUTTS AND I CANNOT LIE

Jack Flanders

11-24-2008, 02:58 AM

I truly hat, hat, hat holidays. didn't use to but do now.

zero

12-02-2008, 02:36 PM

haaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr !

12"razormix

12-02-2008, 03:08 PM

no wonder you're laughing - those furry earmuffs don't even fit you

sometimes it embarrasses me that i'm associated with you

zero

12-02-2008, 03:14 PM

awasnie laughing :mad:

( daft idiot )

( associated my arse! )

12"razormix

12-02-2008, 03:23 PM

... my arse )

this gives me an idea for some self reflecti°ns of my own...

brb

from kitchen: AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHhahhhahahahhahahah

zero

12-02-2008, 03:24 PM

i resent that! :mad: :mad:

12"razormix

12-02-2008, 03:28 PM

you resent my arse? how did you think i feel about it?? it's my arse! it's on ME!

zero

12-02-2008, 03:35 PM

yes but what's yours is mine

12"razormix

12-02-2008, 03:42 PM

if my arse was on y.. CHRIST! nevermind :mad:

zero

12-02-2008, 03:51 PM

i pronounce this ♥self reflecti°n♥ we're having to be of a profound nature - we're getting at several issues in contemporary philosophy of mind, such as the nature of consciousness, the mind-body dichotomy, and sensory perception... all thanks to (y)our arse

bless it!

12"razormix

12-02-2008, 03:54 PM

does that mean no sex on the kitchen table today?

zero

12-02-2008, 04:02 PM

furry earmuffs on, or no?

12"razormix

12-02-2008, 04:09 PM

on YOU

( i have to watch my reputation )

zero

12-02-2008, 04:21 PM

zormix i'd just like to say thank you very much for your kind assistance in this ♥self reflecti°n♥ in which we have explored together the nature of the mind, MENATAL events, MENATAL functions, MENATAL properties, consciousness and their relationship to the physical body, particularly the arse.

clear the table!

12"razormix

12-02-2008, 04:32 PM

http://www.geocities.com/phineasbg/woosh1.jpg

zero

12-02-2008, 04:37 PM

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1046/1391900611_de8db5e7af.jpg

Frieda

12-02-2008, 08:19 PM

http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/3215/200316bcnl11ja2.jpg

brightpearl

12-11-2008, 11:43 AM

This morning I was noticing I was breathing, and I heard the fridge click on...also breathing, I thought, hahaha. And then the heater. Click...whoosh...click...whoosh. And then a bus outside. Thud...vrooom.

I thought of my old cat breathing. My kid breathing. My mother, my father. My dear friend R and her babies, all breathing. I thought of all my friends breathing, and all of you people, breathing all over the world, awake and asleep, happy and sad, some in cold places and some in hot, and all the people I've never met and never will. In. Out. All the people who are gone and not yet born, breathing by not breathing.

It was like the whole world was humming, out into space.

lukkucairi

12-11-2008, 12:21 PM

^ life is like an earthquake

I'm about to step off into the abyss and find out if I can fly, for good and real.

I believe that I can, even through all the second-guessing.

Frieda

12-11-2008, 12:21 PM

look for the monotonous hum, it`s space breathing :)

lukkucairi

12-18-2008, 07:04 AM

http://www.ebbemunk.dk/alice/91red_queen.jpg

shaking

http://www.ebbemunk.dk/alice/92kitten.jpg

waking

zero

01-10-2009, 05:26 PM

http://www.sketchzilla.com/madlibs/pill.gif (http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/134766.php)

"sharing an experience with another person may change the perception we have of our own self, such as the recognition of our own face ...

lukkucairi

01-12-2009, 10:38 AM

questions attached to the self-mummification dream:

why do we punish ourselves? is it so we can feel as if we have control? is it so we can feel "alive" while we drain our own life energy?

dukkha. (http://web.ukonline.co.uk/buddhism/page4.htm)

life is suffering already - suffering outside of our control - why do I assume inflicting more suffering upon myself is going to help the situation?

this whole business of restricting my diet for a week has really challenged me emotionally. I'm grouchy and unstable. I'm looking forward to cheddar again.

a quote from someone, off a sydney blu track:
"sometimes it appears that we're reaching a period when our senses and our minds will no longer respond to moderate stimulation. we seem to be approaching an age of the gross; persuasion through speeches and books is too often discarded for disruptive demonstrations aimed at bludgeoning the unconvinced into action. the young overwhelm themselves with drugs and artificial stimulants. subtlety is lost and fine distinctions based on acute reasoning are carelessly ignored in a headlong jump toward a predetermined conclusion. life is visceral rather than intellectual. and the most visceral practitioners of life are those who characterize themselves as intellectuals."

I'm fascinated by this because you could take those words and apply them almost equally to hippies in the 1960s and neocons in the 2000s. any mass movement is going to involve "bludgeoning the unconvinced into action." we're a bunch of monkeys. tell me, WHEN was this golden age when the masses were persuaded by "fine distinctions based on acute reasoning"?

the assumption - that our lack of discipline is the road to perdition. this conflicts with Blake: "the road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom." who's right?

can reality simply just be attitudinal? I'm beginning to understand this whole "middle way" shit. how can a monk who practices self-mummification be doing anything other than bringing more dukkha into the world? for that matter, a paranoid conservative surrounding herself with guns and drawing violence to her as if magnetically...or an executive secure in himself but working for a company that destroys the planet...or a rave kid stewing his brains every weekend with immense doses of ecstasy...or a 35-year-old woman on a detox diet after years of too much wine, bacon, and kimchi...we punish ourselves in so many different ways. putting down the whip we use for self-flagellation is difficult (until, I suspect, it's suddenly easy).

the zen master whacks me over the head: "SMILE, DOOFUS." two lessons: (1) stinky thoughts are like stinky farts - nobody likes them and you can't hide them from people, so you'd better learn to control your intake in order to control your output. it's OK, you can eat limburger, just not at every meal. (2) it doesn't matter how you feel, as long as you don't feel bad about feeling that way. go ahead and feel insecure and scared, but don't feel insecure and scared about feeling insecure and scared, or you're grasping those emotions and not letting them pass...