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Old 09-11-2005, 02:54 AM   #1906
Deviate
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sparticle - the drama was started when someone saw it fit to make a slam on me in a very distasteful way. maybe, since the majority (if not all) the board does share in my sensitivity on this subject they saw it unnecessary to comment. but it was distasteful, and it was aimed at me, and if i find it necessary to respond it doesn't make me immature. in fact, the immaturity in me kept silent about it for as long as i did.

also, sparticle, please recognize that i didn't respond on this issue for some time, so i was not 'quick to assume that everyone has a problem with [my] gender identity. also, please recognize that there is a definite difference between someone who says, "i don't have a problem with" and someone who is an ally. consider: the frequent scenario of the person who states they don't have a problem with race, or with any person because of their race, but then keeps silent when they hear a racist joke. silence perpetuates. and i almost stayed silent.

internalized oppression is a funny thing - it teaches you that you have no right to challenge the majority, that you have no right to be upset, and that you should keep your mouth shut when someone attacks you. it's very similar to external oppression.

trish - i guess what is bothering me is that if this were an attack on someone based on the minority identities i listed, the board would have been all over the person. the reason why this one is avoided is because it is an issue that the community fails to look at as valid. it is an issue with this space i've had for some time (hence my waning participation), and the objectionable post in question is evident of this nature. it is okay to make fun of those who are gender-variant, and if you do so you will not be challenged.

brynn - you are correct; i didn't consider the possibility of the 'ignore' feature.

and thanks to those of you who are trying to use humour to diffuse the situation. i'm sorry, but this is a very important, real, and difficult issue for me, if not for the rest of you, and i am afraid that the light-hearted banter only detracts from that. however, in most situations i appreciate trying to keep spirits up.

perhaps i'm the one, yet again, who is out of line. however i only felt it was necessary to comment after mentioning this to another board member over dinner and this person seemed to share my distaste in the post. once i realized my emotional reaction may not have been based in personal over-sensitivity i began to contemplate making a statement.

please consider possible parallels drawn up by an acquaintance: if an infertile woman was joked about her inabilty to carry a child or if a person with disabilities was taunted about their lack of motion. my identity was challenged, and in that i was challenged.

if the board collectively would like to write this off as my interest in starting drama than so be it. it would be terribly depressing to see this as the one issue this group refused to be sensitive towards, especially approaching the board's (and my) third anniversary.

but again, i have been distressed at the lack of sensitivity to gender issues on this board for some time. and i have commented much less frequently than i have had issue. "can't change the world," and, "what's the point?" and, "it's your issue, not theirs," have been thoughts that have kept me from speaking.

i don't come to this board to fight for rights or recognition - i used to come for collaboration, humour, information, and the occasional friendship. i hoped i would find understanding and a bit of protection on the sh*t i get from the regular world. if that's not going to happen, well, i'll take my chances in the non-virtual world.

Last edited by Deviate : 09-11-2005 at 03:13 AM.
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Old 09-11-2005, 03:10 AM   #1907
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All I see is somebody who didnt get a joke, havin dinner with somebody who got a big kick about reinforcing your misunderstanding (and misery, how nice), and then when told it was a joke, still didnt get it. What if you'd had dinner with somebody
who had no interest in the board who actually got the joke? Coulda been a
lot happier night for you!

I see no sexual-preference discrimination on this board. I do see self centered people, tho. Can you understand that you didn't get slammed? and if you did understand that, can you drop it?


The lack of response you see just might be
people thinkin, WHOA, she so self absorbed!

It was just a joke. From somebody who doesnt have
a bigoted bone in their body. (cept for people who should know better)
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Old 09-11-2005, 03:32 AM   #1908
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Quote:
also, please recognize that there is a definite difference between someone who says, "i don't have a problem with" and someone who is an ally.
Yep, I'm definitely the bad guy here. I won't pick up the cudgel and get involved in an all out fracas over something you perceived as an insult; that must mean I'm a hater.

Not even approaching valid logic, but carry on.
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Old 09-11-2005, 03:39 AM   #1909
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sparicle - i wasn't saying you were the 'bad guy', i was only pointing out a discrepancy. that is all.

and aud - it is 'he' not 'she', number one, and number two, you don't see the issue because you don't live it.

but thanks for your response, i got the answer i expected, but hoped i wouldn't get.

Last edited by Deviate : 09-11-2005 at 03:48 AM.
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Old 09-11-2005, 04:02 AM   #1910
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he/she whats the dif/ thats my point. you see a difference, i dont. and just because i have not percieved gaybashing...does not infer that I would NOT be offended, cause i would be. Somehow i feel you think everyone has let you down, but I think you have some need to feel opressed.
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Old 09-11-2005, 04:04 AM   #1911
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Well, I have a kid who's about as gender-variant as you can get at eight. I am teaching her gang signs after taking her Friday to get what she describes as a "homeboy cut" in hopeful tones. And if anyone wants to talk shit about her, I'll explore their little pink ones with my favourite black Steve Madden nosepickers.

I inexcusably sometimes get tired of railing against every correctable instance of ignorance that I see. That's wrong, though, you're right. Absolutely right. Fatigue is a poor excuse.
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Old 09-11-2005, 04:15 AM   #1912
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aud - when pronouns are used for me it is 'he' and that is it.

i am not perceiving gaybashing - i am perceiving someone attacking my gender identity and the fact that i am not biologically male.

trish - i appreciate your comment and candor.
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Old 09-11-2005, 04:21 AM   #1913
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Hey, her dad's worry is that kids will tease her.

Apparently, he's right.
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Old 09-11-2005, 04:24 AM   #1914
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that really blows. sometimes parents don't realize sometimes that what they enforce to try to protect their child can end up being so damaging.

and kids suck.
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Old 09-11-2005, 04:49 AM   #1915
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Geez, dev, you make so many rules for yourself. Freakin pronouns?
He doesnt care if you have horns, zebra genitalia and pee in the shower. I see no difference in how he thinks and how I think in terms of this. You are seeing only thru these transgender glasses, and thinking that we are looking at you a certain way. You seem to be coloring your world here, and if I were tc, i would be offended at your assumption. Its way off. There is some bigger picture here that you might be transferring your feelings about. I am tired too, of this, cause no one can tell you anything you just dont want to hear.
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Old 09-11-2005, 04:55 AM   #1916
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deviate
aud - when pronouns are used for me it is 'he' and that is it.
i am not perceiving gaybashing - i am perceiving someone attacking my gender identity and the fact that i am not biologically male.
oh... I just caught this.

Some of us (like me) didn't realize that, plumbing notwithstanding, you're a guy.

Sorry I kept the joke going. I simply didn't know. You're now a "he" in my book.

Now lets get back to killing threads, shall we?
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Old 09-11-2005, 02:11 PM   #1917
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My cat's breath smells like cat food...
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Old 09-11-2005, 02:51 PM   #1918
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deviate
sometimes parents don't realize sometimes that what they enforce to try to protect their child can end up being so damaging.
See, this is totally my POV, which is why she did get the haircut.

I've never seen a person so damned happy about a haircut in my entire life!

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Old 09-11-2005, 02:58 PM   #1919
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God, my kid is 7, has no idea about what money is, and I cut his hair with the dog clipper, what kind of slow lane am I livin in? Gang signs?
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Old 09-11-2005, 03:02 PM   #1920
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Heh, the gang signs are a joke. Though when I see her walk by in her hoodies and jeans, I'm really tempted to pull one. "Peace out, Rabbit!"

ETA: you picks your battles. This isn't about wanting to smoke crack or even skip practicing the violin. It's HAIR.
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