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Old 06-21-2005, 03:39 PM   #61
trisherina
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At my workplace we struggle with the rules/no rules issue a lot. Where people are engaged emotionally, what often happens is that the rules become an "excuse" to clash, and everyone focuses a lot of energy on whether they are following or subverting the rules. I tend to advocate for fewer rules -- the minimum necessary for harmony.

I don't think moderators are a bad thing, as long as it's clearly understood that they are there for the extremes and not to create the place or pass down word from on high. I think a well-placed word from Frieda, for instance (even before she was an official moderator) has often served to keep from sending things to the stratosphere. That's not a bad thing. It should go without saying that good moderation needs to give the impression of scrupulous impartiality and reluctance to intrude; otherwise you've just got a playground with redneck supervisors.

I would have liked to see the reputation point system made user-configurable, on or off. Though at first I thought it was really bizarre, it seemed to have some useful elements.
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Old 06-21-2005, 03:47 PM   #62
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So... to sum up... things used to be much better, but you're not really sure what happened to make them worse and you don't really care in any case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dinzdale
I think the intelligent conversation and ideas are fewer and sometimes very far between. And that's irrespective of if I personally like / dislike / agree / disagree with any subject matter. If what you say is true, then I'm glad I dont visit other "boards this size" for fear of actually losing brain cells via osmosis.

And it's not as funny as it used to be.

How would I change it? I wouldnt know where to start. Perhaps more rooms instead of one giant Chat section. At least then the chances of finding similar interests and actually sharing information about them would be available. But with no reference points I'm probably talking out of my arse as usual. Who knows? I dont even know anyone's views on anything, except who they may or may not vote for.
And I've just realized I dont actually care. I suppose that's how un-interested I have become.

Whatever.


But that's just my opinion.
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Old 06-21-2005, 03:48 PM   #63
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Quote:
otherwise you've just got a playground with redneck supervisors.
no one ever said that i was going to be made a moderator!
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Old 06-21-2005, 04:03 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trisherina
So... to sum up... things used to be much better, but you're not really sure what happened to make them worse and you don't really care in any case.
Not anymore, no. It's lost a lot of interest, which I find is a shame.
And the hopeless thing (which you seem to notice) is that, the board has always been self-regulating by the majority. I think I'm just sad that on a purely selfish level that the things I came here and found dont seem to be here. Even though the board is changing, it's appeal is waning, but as I said, that's only MY opinion.

I think I only started this thread to see if others felt the same way. I know I cant change anything.
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Old 06-21-2005, 04:07 PM   #65
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you could post more often ( the way you used to ) ...
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Old 06-21-2005, 04:43 PM   #66
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dinz you sound like someone in a relationship that has gone stale. this board is mrs dinz no 13!

listen to yourself!

"i dunno.. it's not like it used to be.. we used to have fun together.. now it's only fights.. i don't know if i still care.. and i hate those new so-called "friends" too.."

YOU start by putting on new lingerie. by bringing flowers. by cooking a nice dinner with a good bottle of red. you hardly ever post here anymore! and if you do, you post negative stuff too, just like everybody else. you only see what you want to see! focus on the good stuff.

so maybe take a break, maybe give it a new impulse, it's all up to you..

for what it's worth, i'd like to see some more of you.. you are much appreciated
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Old 06-21-2005, 04:55 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zefrank
this is interesting.

if saxifrage is still here, i'd love to get an idyllic scenario on what a message board should be . saxi should read about "burstiness" theory - not old school anthro to understand online community self organization.

and also from the rest of you. what would a moderator do? inforce something? if so, what and how?

is this board a hodgepodge? if not, how is it organized?

if no moderator, what sort of guiding principles do you think a board should live by? should you write a constitution?

audrey - who's message board should it be? are you looking for a more supportive environment? if so, for whom? everyone? where do opinions come in?

should the board be "closed"? invite only? should the public be able to read it?
Whoa now, quite the contrary, I think this board runs fine as far as I see it. Most people legitimately like each other and enjoy their time spent posting. Hell, this is a prime example of my problem, I drop my opinion and Ze thinks I'm dissin' his board. I seem to come off in a bad light even though I mean well The prior post was just giving my opinion from my personal experiences on message boards. I didn't mean hodge-podge in a bad way, the boards that I have participated in in the past were each oriented toward a particular subject. I am sure this is not the way of all boards but it has been for me. It is easier to keep people in agreement when they are oriented to one goal. Or the site is dedicated to arguement and disagreement (sadly, that is where I fit in). This one is a mix of people and topics.

As far as moderators go I believe that they are best used to eliminate direct personal insults. While critique of an opinion is okay something like "screw you, you're wrong as well as stupid" is unacceptable in a setting like this. You folks come here to chat about events around the world as well as events from daily life. You talk of sending each other cookies and visiting each other, folks, that's a community. That's like small town USA popping up in cyberspace. You have to protect that, it isn't very easy to find. Ultimately it's Ze's world, I am a fan, love his creations, think he is probablly a cool dude. -nuff said-

P.S. not familiar with "burstiness theory" but would like to check it out.
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Old 06-21-2005, 05:26 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Satan
THERE IS NOT ALWAYS TWO SIDES TO EVERY ISSUE. THAT STATEMENT IS A RIDICULOUS SLOGAN INVOKED BY VESTED INTERESTS AND PERPETUATED BY MINDS OF LIMITED SCOPE!!!!!!!!!!


HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHA!!!!


SILLY MORTALS!!!!!!
My God, why have you forsaken me?

Now Satan's milling about...
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Old 06-21-2005, 05:49 PM   #69
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what would a moderator do? inforce something? if so, what and how?
I think it would be nice to have a simple code of conduct for moderators to enforce. Something like, "Respect each other, and if that gets out of hand, moderators will have the power to do X, Y, or Z." Also, some posts should be point-blank deletable by moderators, such as spam, and posts "outing" the personal information of others, which can be dangerous.

is this board a hodgepodge? if not, how is it organized?
I think it's an organized hodgepodge. People certainly come here for different reasons (fiction, debate, or simply to chat and play around), but the board seems to self-organize into those categories, with some members moving between, and others sticking entirely to one section.

As far as board hierarchy goes, well, that's definitely strictly organized, a self-imposed caste system based on length of time here and the perceived "quality" or "value" of a person's posts. Aggressiveness is also clearly a factor.

if no moderator, what sort of guiding principles do you think a board should live by? should you write a constitution?
I think the all-encompassing principle is respect of other members - of their posts, boundaries, and rights.

should the board be "closed"? invite only? should the public be able to read it?
I don't think the board should be closed. There are lots of creative minds who wander in and out of here, notwithstanding all the spammers and et cetera that might be weeded out. Ditto for invite only, because that would still limit members to those who are pre-determined to be acceptable. Bah. 'Sides, creating the criteria for invite only would be v.v. difficult.

I think that the fact that the public can read this board creates self-moderation, or self-censorship, in a good way. Keeps us in check a little. Or at least some of us. For others, it might not be a factor.

Perhaps, though, some kind of graduated membership might be nice. I wasn't entirely opposed to the "must post X amount before you can change your avatar" rule. I was subject to that short-lived rule, and it was a nice rite of passage when I got my avatar. Although that could lead to spamming.

And the trial-restriction-to-a-single-thread for other spammers was nice, too. Not exactly a ban, but something of a "chill the ef out" move.

In sum, I like how this board is open and moderator-free. Since every post is open to interpretation, questionable posts are made even more difficult to pinpoint because of the subtleties of board politics (often only the really old members are aware of all of the facets of any given disagreement).

However, because of the continued growth of the board, as well as its increasingly complex dynamics, I think a very small amount of moderation might be needed in order to weed out only the things that are clearly inappropriate. And since it's your board, Ze, you'd have to pick moderators who you think could moderate in a way that maintains your expectations for the board.

ETA: And I think if you decide to put this moderator-thing into action, you should only have one or two moderators. Too many moderators = too many cooks spoil the broth.

If there were lots of moderators, then there would be an added level of board hierarchy: "Top dogs = moderators, and everyone wants to be one!" Nah. It shouldn't be a status that the members are scrambling to achieve.

Moderators should just be people that you, as board owner, respect. Period.

Last edited by Gatsby : 06-21-2005 at 05:58 PM.
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Old 06-21-2005, 05:50 PM   #70
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the difference between the so called old board and now is that this place used to be civil. you would post what you wanted and not feel someone would question your every word or try to intimidate you.
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Old 06-21-2005, 06:36 PM   #71
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one thought on that though, if the newer members were to read a good number of the early early on posts, especially b/t dinz and i, it would resemble a prolonged flame war. didn't look civil at all. i suspect that civility is subjective
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Old 06-21-2005, 06:46 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beale
one thought on that though, if the newer members were to read a good number of the early early on posts, especially b/t dinz and i, it would resemble a prolonged flame war. didn't look civil at all. i suspect that civility is subjective
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatsby
Since every post is open to interpretation, questionable posts are made even more difficult to pinpoint because of the subtleties of board politics (often only the really old members are aware of all of the facets of any given disagreement).

True dat. But then again, it's common knowledge that you and Dinz are flamers.
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Old 06-21-2005, 06:53 PM   #73
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ok-

so suggestions stand at:

maybe try a broken out set of chat forums: if so what would they be organized around? themes or random places?

some sort of creedo based on respectful behavior: lets write one to see if we can come to a consensus.

a moderation panel or single moderator that will enforce the creedo: who? it can't be me on the day to day - i'm traveling too much and am not "in".
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Old 06-21-2005, 06:55 PM   #74
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sax -

wasn't saying you were dissing me...just that the "group is its worst enemy" stuff is a bit outmoded and says nothing about what "should" be going on.
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Old 06-21-2005, 06:56 PM   #75
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also i like the idea of a suggested reading list for newbies...maybe someone could compile some threads and I will add it to the guidelines.
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