Talk:Fabuloso Friday 2/Fabuloso Chess/Move24

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detailed history | current 3d view
Ze Us consensus
1 d4 d5 56%
2 c4 e6 66%
3 Nc3 Bb4 48%
4 Nf3 Nf6 82%
5 e3 Ne4 56%
6 Qc2 f5 62%
7 Bd3 O-O 83%
8 O-O b6 61%
9 a3 Bxc3 57%
10 bxc3 Ba6 65%
11 Ne5 Nd7 37%
12 Nc6 Qf6 89%
13 f3 Nd6 100%
14 e4 dxc4 100%
15 Be2 e5 100%
16 d5 Nb8 55%
17 Nb4 Bb7 93%
18 a4 a5 100%
19 Na2 Nd7 50%
20 Ba3 Rac8 50%
21 Rab1 Qg5 60%
22 Kh1 fxe4 61%
23 fxe4 Qg6 89%
24 Rxf8+ Rxf8 100%
25 Bxd6 Rf2 100%
26 Rg1 cxd6 100%
27 Qd1 Nf6 73%
28 Bf3 Nxe4 93%
29 Nc1 Rd2 53%
30 Bxe4 Rxd1 100%
31 Bxg6 Rxg1+ 100%
32 Kxg1 hxg6 100%
33 Resign ---

Voting CLOSED: Rxf8

13 votes for Rxf8: 100%

"Oh my god! Ze put us in check!"

Today's Suggested Moves have been posted, and the voting polls will open Monday @7PM EDT and close at Tuesday 12AM EDT (Monday Night), in order to give time for enough deliberation before the votes are cast. Don't have a username/Id yet? Get one here! and take some credit for your contributions!

Remember to check back even if you've already cast your vote! .. there's still some disagreement between potential moves .. and analysis will most likely continue up until Sunday night when the polls close. It's also not too late to submit a vote for another move that has not been evaluated yet .. (although it looks like we have most of the best move options available, people can always miss things).

Use the following tags to help suggest moves, and remember if you want to throw up an example speculative board in the discussion, please refer to the Edit Guide on how to properly format it.

 <!-- ==Speculative Move== -->

 <!-- REMOVE THIS LINE TO INSERT BOARD
{{Chess diagram small|=
| tleft
| Suggested Move: UPDATE THIS
|= 

 8 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |=
 7 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |=
 6 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |=
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 4 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |=
 3 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |=
 2 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |=
 1 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |=
    a  b  c  d  e  f  g  h

| Suggested Move: UPDATE THIS
}}
  REMOVE THIS LINE TO INSERT BOARD -->

 <!-- MAKE CERTAIN YOU ADD A COMMENT TO JUSTIFY THIS POSITION-->

{{clear}}

Just follow the instructions, and completely delete those lines .. and don't forget to replace 'Speculative Move' with the actual move name. Also bear in mind that anything after the clear tag won't be visible, so don't enter any text underneath it (unless you're adding another section)

Voting Instructions

Cut and paste the following to vote

# '''VOTE''' by ~~~~: add a comment! 
  • You may vote for many moves as you like, but only one vote per move.
  • When voting closes, the move with the most votes wins.
  • If there is a tie, whoever tallies the votes breaks the tie.

Strategy Discussion

Current Position
Image:chess_zhor_26.png
Image:chess_zver_26.png
a8 b8 c8 d8 e8 f8 g8 h8
a7 b7 c7 d7 e7 f7 g7 h7
a6 b6 c6 d6 e6 f6 g6 h6
a5 b5 c5 d5 e5 f5 g5 h5
a4 b4 c4 d4 e4 f4 g4 h4
a3 b3 c3 d3 e3 f3 g3 h3
a2 b2 c2 d2 e2 f2 g2 h2
a1 b1 c1 d1 e1 f1 g1 h1
Image:chess_zver_26.png
Image:chess_zhor_26.png
Last Move: Rxf8+

Contents



Please take the time to familiarize yourself with some common middlegame tactics.


Suggested Move Summary

Suggested Position
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Image:chess_zver_22.png
a8 b8 c8 d8 e8 f8 g8 h8
a7 b7 c7 d7 e7 f7 g7 h7
a6 b6 c6 d6 e6 f6 g6 h6
a5 b5 c5 d5 e5 f5 g5 h5
a4 b4 c4 d4 e4 f4 g4 h4
a3 b3 c3 d3 e3 f3 g3 h3
a2 b2 c2 d2 e2 f2 g2 h2
a1 b1 c1 d1 e1 f1 g1 h1
Image:chess_zver_22.png
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Suggested Move: Rxf8
Suggested Position
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Image:chess_zver_22.png
a8 b8 c8 d8 e8 f8 g8 h8
a7 b7 c7 d7 e7 f7 g7 h7
a6 b6 c6 d6 e6 f6 g6 h6
a5 b5 c5 d5 e5 f5 g5 h5
a4 b4 c4 d4 e4 f4 g4 h4
a3 b3 c3 d3 e3 f3 g3 h3
a2 b2 c2 d2 e2 f2 g2 h2
a1 b1 c1 d1 e1 f1 g1 h1
Image:chess_zver_22.png
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Suggested Move: Nxf8
Suggested Position
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Image:chess_zver_22.png
a8 b8 c8 d8 e8 f8 g8 h8
a7 b7 c7 d7 e7 f7 g7 h7
a6 b6 c6 d6 e6 f6 g6 h6
a5 b5 c5 d5 e5 f5 g5 h5
a4 b4 c4 d4 e4 f4 g4 h4
a3 b3 c3 d3 e3 f3 g3 h3
a2 b2 c2 d2 e2 f2 g2 h2
a1 b1 c1 d1 e1 f1 g1 h1
Image:chess_zver_22.png
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Suggested Move: Kxf8



















Rxf8


Suggested Move: Rxf8
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Image:chess_zver_22.png
a8 b8 c8 d8 e8 f8 g8 h8
a7 b7 c7 d7 e7 f7 g7 h7
a6 b6 c6 d6 e6 f6 g6 h6
a5 b5 c5 d5 e5 f5 g5 h5
a4 b4 c4 d4 e4 f4 g4 h4
a3 b3 c3 d3 e3 f3 g3 h3
a2 b2 c2 d2 e2 f2 g2 h2
a1 b1 c1 d1 e1 f1 g1 h1
Image:chess_zver_22.png
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Suggested Move: Rxf8


Position after 25.Bxd6? Rf2!
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Image:chess_zver_22.png
a8 b8 c8 d8 e8 f8 g8 h8
a7 b7 c7 d7 e7 f7 g7 h7
a6 b6 c6 d6 e6 f6 g6 h6
a5 b5 c5 d5 e5 f5 g5 h5
a4 b4 c4 d4 e4 f4 g4 h4
a3 b3 c3 d3 e3 f3 g3 h3
a2 b2 c2 d2 e2 f2 g2 h2
a1 b1 c1 d1 e1 f1 g1 h1
Image:chess_zver_22.png
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
24...Rxf8
25. Bxd6? Rf2! and Ze can resign.
  • No Brainer. Eliminates threat without bringing out king out into the open. Also covers the entire f file. Funky citrus 12:45, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
  • This is definitely the best option. arc
  • And the response to 25. Bxd6 cxd6 26. Bxc4 would be? Moving that rook removes the defense from our c4 pawn.64.7.149.152 12:48, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
    • It seems as though 26. Bxc4 Nc5 and the pawn Ze apparently won soon falls. If 27. Bd3 moves to protect, then 27. .. Bxd5 leads to 28. exd5 Nxd3 winning back the pawn and threatening 29. .. Nf2+ to take white's queen. Otherwise 27. Re1 Rf4 and the pawn dies. Kidnapped
      • 27. .. Bxd5 leads to 28. Bxd5+ and we are cooked!
        • Can someone illustrate this? I lack the foresight and wiki skills...PTWhipplebang 14:36, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
        • Not really. In Kidnapped's example he says If 27. Bd3, which means that Bxd5+ is not possible. We will not do Bxd5 if he has a bishop on c4, but there are plenty of other options like Rf4. arc
    • After 26.Bxc4, 26...Nc5 or Rf4 are both completely winning. -Axl
  • Take a day off, folks. No debate necessary. Other moves are vastly inferior. -Axl
  • Yawn!!! No thinking required. Count me in. V 13:09, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
  • Why would 26.Bxc4 when 26.Bxd6 cxd6 27.Bxc4 and we lose our c4 pawn plus ze now defends d5.
    • Your numbering is one too high. After 26. Bxc4 we play Nc5 and his pawn will fall amongst other goodies. V 13:20, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
    • Look a little deeper... Earlier we considered 25.Bxd6 cxd6 26.Bxc4 Nc5, but after this exchange on f8, in fact we have better: 25.Bxd6? Rf2! (see diagram) and Black is absolutely crushing. So, after 24...Rxf8 25.Bxd6 is not playable for white. 25.Bf3 looks best, but we are still winning handily. -Axl
      • Yes, 25. Bf3 is White's best response but then we play 25...Bxd5. Snark 13:58, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
      • Axl, just out of curiosity, what do we play after 25. Bxd6? Rf2! 26. g3 ? (the question mark is to end my question, not the move). V 14:13, 1 August 2006 (PDT) edit: Never mind. You can still answer, but it looks like a slaughter house the more I look at it.
        • Yes, ...Qh6 27. h4 Qe3 and it's a massacre.
  • What's the response to 25. Bxc4?208.60.177.45 13:49, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
    • Nxc4. We trade a pawn and a rook for two bishops, not bad at all especially when our knight on c4, the bishop, and a soon to be Nc5 are so well placed. arc
        • This leaves the exchange even in material though with us giving up a bit of our positional advantage. BitBender 15:52, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
        • Not so, the Bishop pair is MUCH more important than the Rook and Pawn. This is one case where you can't just "count points". We would have a huge advantage in this line. It's unlikely Ze will play 25.Bxc4. -Axl
        • I think it makes more sense to compare the pieces left rather than the pieces lost when evaluating. This line leaves each side with equal pawns, us with a 2 knights, bishop, queen; him a rook, knight and queen. Its obviously still to our favor, but less so than other positions I evaluated at this point. BitBender [no comment earlier due to blackout last night]
      • Actually, Nxe4 is a better response to Bxc4. Snark 08:24, 2 August 2006 (PDT)
  • Yes, it's open and shut: this is the best move. Snark 13:55, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
  • Due to time zones, I'm voting early. Please consider this my vote. Otis 13:40, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
  • We need to call Ze a hard charger ('cuz he jumped the board from one end to the other) while doing this move. -- BKeyport

VOTING

  1. VOTE by Otis 13:40, 1 August 2006 (PDT): Due to time zones, I'm voting early. Please consider this my vote
  2. VOTE by Jeff 14:22, 1 August 2006 (PDT): I can't wait for the moves to become interesting again.
  3. VOTE by PTWhipplebang 15:53, 1 August 2006 (PDT): This is gonna be sweet.
  4. VOTE by Amorphus 16:03, 1 August 2006 (PDT): yep, next??
  5. VOTE by Axl 16:05, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
  6. VOTE by Kingpatzer 16:34, 1 August 2006 (PDT) : clearly the best choice
  7. VOTE by Jes ter23 16:37, 1 August 2006 (PDT): Onward and upward.
  8. VOTE by Marvelous 16:42, 1 August 2006 (PDT): Obvs.
  9. VOTE by TtT 17:21, 1 August 2006 (PDT): a-chicka-quack-quack
  10. VOTE by Geedubber 17:28, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
  11. VOTE by 68.43.125.79 18:25, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
  12. VOTE by V 18:56, 1 August 2006 (PDT) : chica chica BOOM BOOM!
  13. VOTE by mick129 19:29, 1 August 2006 (PDT) : yay for easy choices


Nxf8


Suggested Move: Nxf8
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Image:chess_zver_22.png
a8 b8 c8 d8 e8 f8 g8 h8
a7 b7 c7 d7 e7 f7 g7 h7
a6 b6 c6 d6 e6 f6 g6 h6
a5 b5 c5 d5 e5 f5 g5 h5
a4 b4 c4 d4 e4 f4 g4 h4
a3 b3 c3 d3 e3 f3 g3 h3
a2 b2 c2 d2 e2 f2 g2 h2
a1 b1 c1 d1 e1 f1 g1 h1
Image:chess_zver_22.png
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Suggested Move: Nxf8
  • Gets us out of check, but keeps the rook in place to back up the c4 pawn. 64.7.149.152 12:50, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
  • We can't give Ze control of the F file, unless we want to do another rook tradeoff. Funky citrus 12:55, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
    • Ze isn't controlling the F file.
      • Not yet, but he can move his other rook over. PTWhipplebang 13:17, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
  • Nxf8?! -- That's going backwards. No way! There's nothing to fear from Bxc4. -Axl
  • This is playable but it doesn't save the c4 pawn anyway. After white defends against Bxd5 with 25. Rb2 what do we do? We can nab the e4 pawn with 25. ... Qxe4 26. Qxe4 Nxe4 but then white can go ahead and 27. Bxc4 anyway. I think black is still winning but 24. ... Rxf8 is a more convincing win. Don't forget white's king is in a very vulerable spot right now so having a rook on the open f-file gives us a lot of leverage. Jeff 13:19, 1 August 2006 (PDT)


Kxf8


Suggested Move: Kxf8
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Image:chess_zver_22.png
a8 b8 c8 d8 e8 f8 g8 h8
a7 b7 c7 d7 e7 f7 g7 h7
a6 b6 c6 d6 e6 f6 g6 h6
a5 b5 c5 d5 e5 f5 g5 h5
a4 b4 c4 d4 e4 f4 g4 h4
a3 b3 c3 d3 e3 f3 g3 h3
a2 b2 c2 d2 e2 f2 g2 h2
a1 b1 c1 d1 e1 f1 g1 h1
Image:chess_zver_22.png
Image:chess_zhor_22.png
Suggested Move: Kxf8

Added because it is the other option to get us out of check. 64.7.149.152 12:53, 1 August 2006 (PDT)

  • What's that, "the sympathy suggestion?" ;) Obviously out of the question -- this move immediately loses the c4 pawn with no compensation. -Axl
    • HAHA! It's standard practice to enter all possible moves if there aren't many. It allows to get a visual grasp of different positions and what's involved. Not necessarily as a real suggestion. V 13:11, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
      • I getcha...Of course we could vote for this just to make it interesting. The game would be back to equal. Would a little selective hari-kari make us true SRs or paltry HCs? -Axl
      • uh... Isn't this actually the only move after which we CAN defend both b and c pawns?
      • We wouldn't be defending the c pawn because the d6 knight becomes pinned.
        • That's true. Now Ze has us in a King Knight skewer which pins our knight to the king. We can't move the d6 knight to defend c4 because that would put us in check. That means he can take c4 with no worries. Jes ter23 14:52, 1 August 2006 (PDT)
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