Talk:the show with zefrank

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Before we Begin This page really ought to work in conjunction with the the_show:_Episode_Guide but I don't really know how. A little help? [LoA] bodog_formerly_byslexic 21:16, 18 June 2006 (PDT)

  • I made a first pass over it. It's a start. What ideas did you have? muyfabulosotalk 20:24, 19 June 2006 (PDT)
  • thanks for the input - I see where you're going. I'm thinking that somehow the episode guide becomes like an index, and the the_show page becomes like the FAQ, but without the Q part. Been working very hard on the the_show page, but not on the episode guide. I think now perhaps the best way for them to work together is to "position" them in the grand wiki scheme so as to be easily accessible. Main problem as I see it right now is the the_show page's title. Too similar to the_show: 061606 and others that are multiplying now. How to work this thing? If you're looking for something specific, like a particular topic, you can check the episode guide, or on the other hand, if you want to find a song, the the_show page has them listed under one heading. I liked what somebody did with adding the members of the LOA as a link from the LOA entry. So that's me brainstorming, without a clear idea how to make it happen. I've never been good at filing things in filing cabinets. A wiki is even worse for me. Thanks again for your excellent work. [LoA] bodog_formerly_byslexic 20:57, 19 June 2006 (PDT)

Thanks again Muy and Sford, for cleaning this page up. Still trying to figure out how to link to another section on the same page - internal references, so if you're reading about Sports racers and it mentions HArd Chargers, you could click the link to the hard charger section. can't make it work. .. can't find a good instance on another page to copy...I don't get it. how do you work this thing??? [LoA] bodog_formerly_byslexic 22:00, 20 June 2006 (PDT)

I'm sorry, but this page succeeds in making the show boring to me. If I came across this page before watching the show, I wouldn't want to watch it. I'd like to see more of Ze's irony and humor reflected on this page, rather than a fanzine-like obsessive list of events pandering to Ze. The page does nothing more than reflect back to Ze and fans what they already know. It doesn't add anything substantial. Ze's show is more than funny little bits. He comments on the news and sets up projects for online community participation. It's a huge Web improv. I've added little bits here and there, but they have gotten smoothed over by edits that make them as potent as a corporate mission statement. Just my humble opinion. Yves 09:18, 25 June 2006 (PDT)

  • Yves, you're sort of right, but this page is perhaps not meant for you. My thought was that it was just a resource for those new viewers who really didn't have a clue and just wanted somebody to briefly explain the "in jokes". If they are interested in the show enough to have gotten here, perhaps they'll click the links to the original shows where Ze actually created the terminology they're reading about, and be entertained. Getting in on the joke is what makes fans. Trying to recreate Ze's irony and humor here would be dificult and maybe pointless, given (a) the fabulosos already writing Ze's gags are rarely as funny as Ze himself (sorry fabs!), and (b) Ze's humor is linked to in archives. I know I can't write as funny as Ze. This page IS a good resource if you want to know where to find that one song Ze did, or the original Hard Charger reference, or see what Power Moves Ze has featured. Sure, I'd like to see the page have some more character, but remain correct and accurate. How to do that without adding fiction? not sure. Pandering? To Ze? I don't think so. [LoA] bodog_formerly_byslexic 10:46, 25 June 2006 (PDT)
  • Okay, pandering wasn't the right word. The page reads more like a fan-obsessed list written to ingratiate oneself with Ze; how a child would explain their favorite show to their grandmother; or a bunch of notes to use during an interview or in preparing an article about the site. As a resource, I suppose it's good, but in that case, I'd like to see it have no personality whatsoever, for example, I'd re-write the recurring themes section as follows:

Recurring themes

  • Are the New Viewers Gone Yet? A boring or inane segment sometimes used to begin the show, ending with the rhetorical "Are the new viewers gone yet?", after which the show begins in earnest.
Memorable Instances:
  • S-s-s-somethin' From the Comments. A segment where Ze reads one or more comments from viewers of the previous show.

"Any individual entity that presumes to understand the rules that guide this space is under an illusion."
--Ze Frank

Ze has little to say about viewers who post comments that say nothing but "First", but he did say something, on May 12, 2006. He quoted a viewer comment, and summarized it as: "...I bet you think 'Comments are to be used in a particular way and that particular way is not when people post comments like First.' " His response? "Sports racers don't follow artificially imposed rules on conversation spaces!" The result was Comment King of the Hill.
  • Songs. Ze has composed and performed songs, complete with instrumental accompaniment, to emphasize a point or concept.
For a complete list, see List of songs performed on the show
  • Say the Opposite! After quoting a Hard Charger in the news who has directly contradicted either him/herself or the plain facts, Ze responds in a singsong voice: "Say the opposite, say the opposite! Say the same thing, say the same thing!", possibly implying that Hard Chargers tend to commandeer an argument or issue by creating their own version of "the truth", exactly opposite of reality.
  • Something I Like That's Gay! Occasionally Ze points out something he likes that's "gay". "Gay" has been defined as "Of, relating to, or having a sexual orientation to persons of the same sex" ([ definition]). Contemporarily, in the U.S., it has been used as slang for something distasteful. Ze's delivery, announcing these items with a brief jingle, plays with the irony of this dichotomy to create humor. It started when a comment asked if he was gay. He replied that he is not gay, but he likes gay things (see first memorable instance below).
Memorable Instances:
  • Photos. Ze sometimes illustrates news stories with seemingly-unrelated photographs as he narrates, leaving viewers to determine the actual connection to the topic. Very often the photos are actually viewer-submitted pictures or short clips of sports racer logos, power moves, t-shirt designs, etc.
  • Duckies. Ze sometimes affectionately includes references to duckies and "the little duckies in the pond" whenever he finds the opportunity.
  • Blinking. Frequent viewers may notice that Ze prefers very close proximity with the camera. In early shows (March-April 2006) he blinked as ordinary people do. Then he stopped blinking. In response to a user comment on May 10, 2006, he explained that he doesn't like to blink because his left nostril tends to flare every time he blinks "which looks weird." Although this appears to be a ruse, he now seems to reserve blinking only for special occasions.
  • Signoff. Ze's usual signoff is "This is Ze Frank, thinking so you don't have to."

If you have no objections, I'll remove this from the discussion page and put it on the article page. Yves 09:27, 26 June 2006 (PDT)

That's an interesting discussion. There's more questions like this being asked here and there, like what should the feel of the wiki be, is it inviting enough, is there an us vs. them problem even. I've made a page that could serve as a place to collect and continue these conversations. -Disso 09:41, 26 June 2006 (PDT)

  • Regarding "Sports Racers": This phrase reminds me of the German "Sportsfreund(e)" (sports fan(s)), which can be used to jovially but slightly ironically adress somebody.
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