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Old 02-04-2006, 03:00 PM   #1
Smartypants
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The Latest Dangerous Religious Idiocy

Just so Brynn (and everyone else) doesn't think my contempt for religious dogma is limited to that of the Christian church...

This latest craziness regarding the caricaturization of Mohammed in a Danish newspaper is just another example of the kind of insane behavior we can all expect to continue as long as criticism of religion remains off-limits. As I've stated before, no other irrational or dangerous beliefs enjoy this exemption. As Sam Harris discusses in The End of Faith, the blame for this kind of violence (and the expectation that it will escalate and threaten civilization) can be placed as much on religious moderates who perpetuate the taboos against criticizing people's faith as on religion's extremist followers.

Where are all the "moderate Muslims" who eschew claims that Islam teaches intolerance and violence (and who insist it is a reasonable religion) to speak against the over-reaction to cartoons that raise perfectly reasonable criticism of their religion's extremist teachings? If the insanity and violence are to stop, it is those so called moderates, and not secular critics, who are responsible for calling for its cessation by denouncing -- not dancing around -- the actions of their fellow faithful.

From http://onegoodmove.org/1gm/ this morning:
Quote:
BULLIES

Jyllands-Posten Muhammad cartoons controversy


Since when does belief in a mythical god trump the belief in freedom of speech as enshrined in the 'sacred documents' of western democracies. And doesn't the muslim world's reaction to the cartoons confirm elements of the criticism the cartoons express. We don't give others with strong beliefs a free pass from criticism, or from ridicule. Why is it that the Muslims think their beliefs are immune to criticism. The idea that any religion should get a free pass from criticism is absurd. Those who claim they believe in free speech, but who accept the boycotts, the threats of violence, the intimidation as legitimate are liars. The only legitimate response to free speech is the exercise of one's own free speech. Those who attempt to destroy those whose speech they disagree with are bullies and have no place in a civilized world. It is the response of totalitarians who fear open and honest debate. Here is a short segment on the controversy from Nightline.
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Old 02-04-2006, 07:23 PM   #2
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not very moderate

also not very moderate

even less moderate

possibly less moderate still
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Old 02-04-2006, 08:50 PM   #3
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at least al-Sistani's sane... even if a certain Canadian cartoonist is not
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Old 02-05-2006, 12:27 AM   #4
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guess who
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Old 02-05-2006, 09:15 AM   #5
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hmmm shame the [IMG] doesnt work in this subforum..



http://img487.imageshack.us/img487/7...n3101068nr.gif

it says:


outrageous! this is going too far! action! the prophet in a cartoon!



the newspaper says:
  • suicide attacks on buses, clubs, hotels in israel, bali, egypt
  • 100,000 dead during violence in sudan and algeria
  • islamic extremists strike on WTC
  • madrid, london: bombing in trains and subway
  • car bombs in iraq
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Old 02-05-2006, 09:42 AM   #6
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it's only because of the freedom of speech that people can believe what they want to believe. this right gives someone else the freedom to think the quran is as believeable as donald duck magazine and lay a turd on it. thats the price that has to be paid, period. i mean, everybody can make up excuses that its insulting and that makes it not legal.. but then someone can make islam itself illegal because its "insulting". anything can be said, except calling out for violence. if you dont like it, then dont make the door hit you on the way out.

so let them boycott danish products, i assume the middle east will live on a diet of oil and sand from now on, they dont produce that much over there. that they're angry in the middle east, fine. let them boycott everything, it's their right! they dont live with our rights and obligations. they keep yelling its not true but meanwhile they confirm the image in the cartoons by yelling for violence.

i guess in the end we're just being bitten in our asses by our own actions.. a century of messing with the middle east with their corrupt regimes and everything to make sure it doesnt develop and become independent. its not weird when people that dont have anything to live for hold on to a religion or something.

other than that, all i see on tv is a small group of idiots and i havent seen the other billion shouting for revenge so i refuse to believe that every muslim feels like setting embassies on fire.

anyway, the bread roll i got today at the moroccan bakery still tasted good, at least they're open on sundays!
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Last edited by Frieda : 02-05-2006 at 09:44 AM.
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Old 02-05-2006, 09:29 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frieda
i guess in the end we're just being bitten in our asses by our own actions.. a century of messing with the middle east with their corrupt regimes and everything to make sure it doesnt develop and become independent. its not weird when people that dont have anything to live for hold on to a religion or something.
Natch.

"And civil society means that free expression trumps the emotions of anyone to whom free expression might be inconvenient. It is depressing to have to restate these obvious precepts, and it is positively outrageous that the administration should have discarded them at the very first sign of a fight."

And natch.
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Old 02-06-2006, 01:48 AM   #8
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a slightly different response

.
Quote:
UK cartoon: Naked Sharon eats babies
Winner of top prize depicts prime minister devouring Palestinian

2003 WorldNetDaily.com

A cartoon that won first prize in Britain depicts Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon eating the head of a Palestinian baby with a burning city in the background.

Published in the Independent newspaper of London, the cartoon was one of 35 entries in the British Political Cartoon Society's annual competition, reported the Israeli daily Haaretz.

The Cartoon of the Year competition is sponsored by the Independent.

The prize-winner depicts Sharon saying: "What's wrong? Have you never seen a politician kissing a baby?"

The cartoonist, Dave Brown, thanked the Israeli embassy in Britain for increasing the cartoon's publicity by its angry reaction.

In January, Shuli Davidovich, the embassy's press secretary, wrote to the British paper: "As Britain commemorates National Holocaust Day, I am shocked that The Independent has chosen to evoke an ancient Jewish stereotype which would not have looked out of place in 'Der Sturmer', and which can unfortunately still be found in many Arabic newspapers.

"The blood-thirsty imagery not only misrepresents the real reason for the IDF's [Israeli Defense Forces] operations in Gaza, but also feeds the hostility toward Israel and the Jewish people which lies at the very core of the Arab-Israeli conflict."

She adds: "One must be extremely careful to draw the line between legitimate criticism and the anti-Semitism that often parades as such."

Political cartoon in the Arab media often depict Jews as hook-nosed schemers seeking world domination.

A political cartoon depicting the Palestinians and Iraqis as victims of crucifixion by the United States was published in the Palestinian Authority's largest daily, Al Quds.

In the cartoon, the figures are nailed to a cross back to back, with the Palestinian bearing the thought, "Brother from Iraq," and the Iraqi, "Relative from Palestine."
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Old 02-06-2006, 06:19 AM   #9
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^^

Heh.

From an email from Snake's Dad:

"4 Minorities in countries should put up with what the majority wants. Jews are very good at putting up with majority pork eating and becoming respected members of the community, and they don't try to convert everybody to Judaism."
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Old 02-06-2006, 02:55 PM   #10
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how can anyone believe in a god so fragile that he/she/it
could be hurt by some cartoon?

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Old 02-06-2006, 11:18 PM   #11
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wikipedia
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Old 02-07-2006, 11:55 AM   #12
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was the answer in there?

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Old 02-07-2006, 12:39 PM   #13
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i don't think that the islamic way of thinking can be measured with western standards.

Quote:
Islamic teachings forbid the depiction of Muhammad as a measure against idolatry
Aniconism in Islam
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Old 02-08-2006, 12:35 AM   #14
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should I even have kids?


This is insane...
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Old 02-08-2006, 02:26 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zenbabe
should I even have kids?


This is insane...
my answer would be no.
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