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Old 10-26-2006, 11:22 AM   #16
Brynn
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I do think that there is a bias against obese people, who are that way for many reasons, not just from eating too much.

Unfortunately, it seems as if the world is in this weird self-protective mindset that is constantly comparing one individual against another. it's like a secret language everyone constantly speaks - no matter what it is that is happening or is being discussed, everyone is consciously or unconsciously comparing themselves to someone else. We are somehow wired to need to be told what our essential value is as a human being by someone else.
The people who don't seem to be always doing this stand out as the rare, self-assured exception.
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Old 10-26-2006, 11:38 AM   #17
Avalon
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Quote:
We are somehow wired to need to be told what our essential value is as a human being by someone else.
This is too true; all you need do is look at a magazine.
We are working hard to instill good, if not great, self esteem in our girls. Seems to be working as the 8 year old's mantra is "I ROCK".

eta..
we also harp (constantly) on respect for other people's feelings and rights. It is a fine line..the one between good self esteem and smugness. The girls have spent some "quality" time having this explained. We just want them to be happy, thoughtful human beings.
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Last edited by Avalon : 10-26-2006 at 11:43 AM.
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Old 10-26-2006, 11:52 AM   #18
auntie aubrey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brynn
The people who don't seem to be always doing this stand out as the rare, self-assured exception.
perhaps they are on the path of becoming masters of the Tao.

Quote:
When people see things as beautiful,
ugliness is created.
When people see things as good,
evil is created.

Being and non-being produce each other.
Difficult and easy complement each other.
Long and short define each other.
High and low oppose each other.
Fore and aft follow each other.

Therefore the Master
can act without doing anything
and teach without saying a word.
Things come her way and she does not stop them;
things leave and she lets them go.
She has without possessing,
and acts without any expectations.
When her work is done, she take no credit.
That is why it will last forever.
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Old 10-26-2006, 03:29 PM   #19
Coffee
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6' 3" - 140lbs. Size 12 Bwidth feet. I have NEVER been able to shop and find clothes that "fit". The "Baggy" look is by circumstance, not choice. My friends hang their ceiling fans at the Frontal Lobotomy level.

Everyone is probably "some" kind of "minority".
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Old 10-26-2006, 03:44 PM   #20
dinzdale
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Yes, even the chronically flatulent have their tale to tell.


...Um.....I should think.
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Old 10-26-2006, 04:16 PM   #21
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Design for Obesity

I get what you were saying Auntie Aubrey, that obviously commercialisms tends to the masses and I’m not saying that should change, but there are other ways people can even things out. During the fashion week in Milan for instance, the government banned models below a certain BMI. I’m sure there are other examples and was wondering what everyone thought of these sorts of ideas.
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Old 10-26-2006, 04:20 PM   #22
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Please design somewhere where I can smoke in peace and not be hounded either out of the door or into a disgusting corner.
My option will always be to stay home, but, by golly, the world NEEDS me out there in the bars and clubs, ripped to the tits and glorious.
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Old 10-26-2006, 05:42 PM   #23
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^^^ ^^^ Hear, hear!
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Old 10-27-2006, 08:13 AM   #24
auntie aubrey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inclusivedesign
I get what you were saying Auntie Aubrey, that obviously commercialisms tends to the masses and I’m not saying that should change, but there are other ways people can even things out. During the fashion week in Milan for instance, the government banned models below a certain BMI. I’m sure there are other examples and was wondering what everyone thought of these sorts of ideas.
these ideas are silly. here's an idea: instead of forcing everyone to capitulate to the social pressure of NOT being different (a la normalizing obesity in the hopes the fat people won't notice they're fat, a la putting skinny models out of work because they make average sized women go "boo hoo") how about we just figure out how to embrace our differences and get along in life BECAUSE of them rather than IN SPITE of them.

what you're basically suggesting is that we go back to that "politically correct" fad that we all enjoyed back in the early 90s where suddenly short people were "vertically challenged americans" and people with big noses were "smelling enhanced." and in the meantime you couldn't tell a "yo mama's so fat" joke without being labeled "insensitive."

the world is not fair. period. forcing people to accomodate the world's differences by cushioning the details that illustrate our differences doesn't solve a thing.
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Old 10-27-2006, 11:47 AM   #25
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So how do we ‘figure out how to embrace our differences and get along in life’?

Is this something we leave to the random progression of society or should those with authority use there position to try and steer things?
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Old 10-27-2006, 12:21 PM   #26
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should those with authority use there position to try and steer things?
More government, just what we need.
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Old 10-27-2006, 12:26 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inclusivedesign
So how do we ‘figure out how to embrace our differences and get along in life’?

Is this something we leave to the random progression of society or should those with authority use there position to try and steer things?
i think the answer to that depends on whether you believe in more or less control over freedom of thought.

me, i believe completely in the freedom of thought and the ability of the masses to come to a reasonable conclusion on what they think is acceptable or unacceptable in society. it's a fluid thing, but we generally keep ourselves in check. and enmasse our buying power determines what we accept from the consumer marketplace.

therefore i only see authority as relevant when a violation of defined civil rights has happened. if someone loses a job because their boss thinks they're too fat, let's call in the authorities. but it doesn't violate anyone's civil rights if designers in milan want to design for tall, skinny women. if there's money in it, they'll keep doing what they do. if there's more money in designing for average sized women, they'll do that too. and, as retailers like lane bryant discovered, if there's money in designing for large women they'll make money at that too.

the best thing people can do for a pro-obesity-acceptance platform is win the PR campaign for body acceptance. change the hearts and minds of the populace to be more accepting of obesity and the marketplace will shift its purchasing power accordingly.
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Old 10-27-2006, 05:02 PM   #28
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hmm...just a comment.

I certainly think people should not be discriminated based on body type...some folks are big just because they and their ancestors are and always have been big. Their genes are programed to make their body's be comfortable at a larger size that what is considered "average".

But the idea of "accepting" obesity bothers me on one level...the level that obesity is inherently unhealthy for those who grow to a size larger than their body's would be if they ate a ballanced diet of healthy food and engaged in at least some exercise. Im refering specifically to the fast food drive thru culture.

I think there should be some better education or "influence" to (again, not discriminate but rather) encourage people to steer clear of that kind of "Eat it now, worry about it later...if at all" mentality. Filling arteries and hearts with fatty deposits shortens life spans, and takes parents away from children early. Obese folks do not take their children on hikes to discover nature...well, that is an assumption that they, on average, do less hiking than "fitter" people...and some folks just aren't into nature anyhow so maybe that last is not a valid point.

However, if people make a conscious choice that they LIKE to be obese...more power too em. Viva la difference. I'd put that in the same category of folks that like to pierce and mutilate their bodies for the "fashion" of it. It does take all kinds after all.
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Old 10-27-2006, 09:02 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coffee
hmm...just a comment.

I certainly think people should not be discriminated based on body type...some folks are big just because they and their ancestors are and always have been big. Their genes are programed to make their body's be comfortable at a larger size that what is considered "average".

But the idea of "accepting" obesity bothers me on one level...the level that obesity is inherently unhealthy for those who grow to a size larger than their body's would be if they ate a ballanced diet of healthy food and engaged in at least some exercise. Im refering specifically to the fast food drive thru culture.

I think there should be some better education or "influence" to (again, not discriminate but rather) encourage people to steer clear of that kind of "Eat it now, worry about it later...if at all" mentality. Filling arteries and hearts with fatty deposits shortens life spans, and takes parents away from children early. Obese folks do not take their children on hikes to discover nature...well, that is an assumption that they, on average, do less hiking than "fitter" people...and some folks just aren't into nature anyhow so maybe that last is not a valid point.

However, if people make a conscious choice that they LIKE to be obese...more power too em. Viva la difference. I'd put that in the same category of folks that like to pierce and mutilate their bodies for the "fashion" of it. It does take all kinds after all.
yes listen to Coffee , he is very smart!
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Old 10-27-2006, 11:03 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brynn
I live five miles from Beaverton, OR.

You can actually buy jerseys from the city's baseball farm league:
The Fighting Beavers
I would like info on ordering. That is hysterical.
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